A Historical-Metaphorical Approach to Buddhist Scriptures

[Aminah]

Hi folks.

Please cool it down.

Again, for those who can’t remember what the forum guidelines say about the Watercooler category:

The Watercooler Category

If posting to the Watercooler category please take particular care to make sure your post belongs there. As noted above, this forum is about Early Buddhist Texts. We do, nevertheless, have a Watercooler category for more informal, relaxed, light-hearted exchange. We still encourage that posts to this category are related to the Dhamma, but this is not a fixed rule and an amount of leeway is allowed for other topics. However, there is no leeway with regards to the guideline that all posts to the Watercooler must be of a friendly, light-hearted and harmony-promoting nature. The Watercooler is a place to support each other and make connections, not to prove a point or for heated debate. Threads that stray from this category’s purpose will be moved, closed or deleted.

[Gabriel_L]

@Kensho

Nichiren hated Pure Land Buddhism in all forms. Please don’t associate me with him. I have no incentive whatsoever for lying about my personal religious beliefs or intentions.

Sure. But note that in a broader sense shakubuku is proselytism. And it is closely related to the view that those involved in promoting Mahayana sutra-related Buddha nature teachings receive “extra good karma” points towards their bodhisattva “quest”.

To me, it is good to have that cleared. I have dealt with shakubuku before, from individuals both related to Nichirenism and not. And having with them dialogue is just impossible!

[Kensho]

@dharmacorps

@Kensho

Did you even read the OP? It doesn’t even mention Mahayana Buddhism.

I wasn’t commenting on your OP but on your innumerable other posts reiterating your same exact position.

Why not discuss the OP, which goes into detail regarding early Buddhist texts, if one is interested in discussing early Buddhist texts?

It just so happens that the distinction between relative truth and ultimate truth, which is so important in Mahayana Buddhism, was originally taught in the Nikayas/Agamas.

[Kensho]

@Gabriel_L

…receive “extra good karma” points towards their bodhisattva “quest”.

Such superstition would go against the clear instruction of Jodo Shinshu Buddhism:

Guided by the teaching of Shinran Shonin, we shall listen to the compassionate calling of Amida Tathagata and recite the Nembutsu. While always reflecting on ourselves, amidst our feelings of regret and joy, we shall live expressing our gratitude without depending on petitionary prayer and superstition.
Teachings | Jodo Shinshu Hongwanji-ha (Nishihongwanji)

[Kensho]

@santa100

And the Lotus school guys would say the same thing about Pure Land guys.

No, Nichiren is rather unique in Mahayana history for advocating outright hatred and hostility toward other Buddhist schools and sects.

According to legend, Shinran was friends with Zen master Dogen, and Shinran’s successor and blood descendant, Rennyo, made it official policy to not disparage other Buddhist sects.

Nichiren, on the other hand, called for the beheading of his religious opponents.

[Kensho]

@Aminah

We still encourage that posts to this category are related to the Dhamma…

I am unapologetically a Mahayana Buddhist, and therefore regard Mahayana teachings as within the Dharma.

At the same time, I have no intention whatsoever of converting non-Mahayana Buddhists to Mahayana Buddhism.

Ideally, Buddhists should be secure enough in their own beliefs as to engage in discussion with members of other sects in an irenic fashion, without feeling threatened by it.

[Mkoll]

I don’t think the people who have voiced disapproval are threatened. More like annoyed. I’m sure you don’t have bad intentions, but you’re here on a forum dedicated to early Buddhist texts talking about Mahayana concepts that really have no bearing. It comes across as a little tactless.

[Kensho]

@Mkoll

I don’t think the people who have voiced disapproval are threatened. More like annoyed. I’m sure you don’t have bad intentions, but you’re here on a forum dedicated to early Buddhist texts talking about Mahayana concepts that really have no bearing. It comes across as a little tactless.

This is the Water Cooler section of the forum, and I have no intent whatsoever of converting others to Mahayana Buddhism. Also, the OP of this thread goes into detail regarding the early Buddhist texts, in which the Buddha distinguishes between relative truth and ultimate truth.

[Mat]

@Kensho

This is the Water Cooler section of the forum, and I have no intent whatsoever of converting others to Mahayana Buddhism

Have you now finished saying all you have to say about it?

[Mkoll]

Well you certainly intend to share information on and your interpretation of Mahayana concepts, repeatedly. That can be easily perceived as proselytizing in this setting, regardless of your intentions. Hence, my use of the word tactless.

[Aminah]

@Kensho

@Aminah

We still encourage that posts to this category are related to the Dhamma…

I am unapologetically a Mahayana Buddhist, and therefore regard Mahayana teachings as within the Dharma.

At the same time, I have no intention whatsoever of converting non-Mahayana Buddhists to Mahayana Buddhism.

Ideally, Buddhists should be secure enough in their own beliefs as to engage in discussion with members of other sects in an irenic fashion, without feeling threatened by it.

Thanks for your reply. I’m very happy you find satisfaction in the tradition you follow, however, I don’t see that as any reason as to why the forum guidelines should apply to you any less than any one else.

It is wonderful to have Mahayana Buddhists and in fact non-Buddhists use this forum, but the fact remains it is a site concerned with the Early Buddhist Texts. We do at the same time want to allow a space for easy-going, friendly exchange and that is what the Watercooler category is for. We’d be grateful if you and all other users adhered to the guidelines when posting.

[Vstakan]

@Kensho

WTF? Nichiren hated Pure Land Buddhism in all forms.

@Kensho

No, Nichiren is rather unique in Mahayana history for advocating outright hatred and hostility toward other Buddhist schools and sects.

@Kensho

We’re sort of like the Buddha’s parable of the blind men and the elephant, doing our best to grasp at a reality beyond any of our understandings. We’re therefore bound to seek truth in different ways and come to different conclusions, while still all remaining under the umbrella of Buddhism, and there’s nothing wrong with that.

[santa100]

@Kensho

No, Nichiren is rather unique in Mahayana history for advocating outright hatred and hostility toward other Buddhist schools and sects.

According to legend, Shinran was friends with Zen master Dogen, and Shinran’s successor and blood descendant, Rennyo, made it official policy to not disparage other Buddhist sects.

Nichiren, on the other hand, called for the beheading of his religious opponents.

You’ve been proving my point all along. If you’re still entangled with your own sectarian conflict, don’t expect others to listen to that multi-door idea you’ve been preaching. It should be a good time for you now to get out of all that Shinran, Rennyo, Nichiren, etc. and get back to the teaching of the Buddha. At the very least, this won’t let to another incident of some famous Mahayana master calling for the beheading of his religious opponents. Afterall, don’t blame the guy. Blame the ignorant disciples who put him on the altar and worship him instead of the Buddha.

[Aminah]

@santa100

You’ve been proving my point all along.

The thing is, once again, the guidelines state:

The Watercooler is a place to support each other and make connections, not to prove a point or for heated debate.

This thread will now be closed.

Again, I politely request that users keep to the forum guidelines or refrain from posting.

Warm regards to all.