B.Sujato definition of sankappo in MN 117, vacī-saṅkhāra in MN 44

I think that’s a reasonable interpretation. The ideas themselves are represented by perceptions, S&S (sati and sampajano), which survive into the 4th jhana, but V&V would involve the energetic expenditure of organizing those ideas into symbols and words that can be spoken coherently.

I don’t think it needs to be retained in pali, but it does need to be consistently translated to maintain coherence everywhere in the suttas. If you look at what all the other professional translators use (see other recent article), including Ven. Analayo’s from the other EBT schools, they all at least contain some connection to ideas or thought, and retain the ability to do vipassana. “Placing the mind and keeping it connected” loses the ability to do vipassana, and the connection to higher order ideas. It’s too low level, redundant to manasi karoti / attention towards perceptions.

So this isn’t just about preferences, it’s about preserving meaning and coherence. You also forgot to consider the implications of noble silence, the relationship between hearing, speaking, that V&V=vaci-sankhara, the thoughts you think before you say them.

The Buddha is telling the monks, when you guys are out and about, if you gather you should either talk (vaca, speaking out loud) about the Dhamma, or maintain noble silece (defined as second jhana, where V&V has stopped). So obviously V&V can not just be “placing the mind and keeping it connected”, that would not be “talking about the Dhamma” (thinking thoughts about the Dhamma but not vocalizing it). Placing the mind would not qualify breaking noble silence. If B.Sujato’s translation of V&V is correct, then first jhana, and VRJ first jhana would be noble silence.

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