Expanding the peyyālas: question about ranges in segment numbers

Q & A
1

Continuing the discussion from Expanding the peyyālas: question about DN10 root Pali text:

So yes, I’ve worked out how to make use of this kind of thing, but there are some problems and so I have another question. I did this in DN 10 Subha, which allocates 3 section numbers fewer than needed for corresponding DN 2 sections, so in that case I combined three pairs of sections toward the end of the long section on ethics into one virtual section each, to make it fit. DN 11 Kevaḍḍha & DN 13 Tevijja also have one hyphenated section range each, but I haven’t gotten to my second pass over them yet and didn’t try to do this in my first pass.

Now I’m working on DN 12 Lohicca, which is exciting because it has not one, but three different section ranges designated.

The three hyphenated section numbers are 20-55, 56-62, & 63-77. Let’s take a look at the first and last anchor segments in each to find out how to map these to the section numbers in DN 2. (Not really first and last, because blank segments and refrain segments don’t tell us where we are in the passage.)

dn12:20-55.1: “It’s when a Realized One arises in the world, perfected, a fully awakened Buddha …
dn12:20-55.3: They enter and remain in the first absorption …

dn12:56-62.2: They enter and remain in the second absorption …
…
dn12:56-62.4: fourth absorption.

dn12:63-77.2: They project and extend the mind toward knowledge and vision …
…
dn12:63-77.5: They understand: ‘… there is nothing further for this place.’
dn12:63-77.6: A teacher under whom a disciple achieves such a high distinction is one who does not deserve to be reprimanded. When someone reprimands such a teacher, the reprimand is false, baseless, illegitimate, and blameworthy.”

We need to map 37 sections of earlier DN 2 text into 36 allocated section numbers, and 16 sections of later DN 2 text into 15 allocated section numbers. On the other hand, we have an extra number allocated in the middle group, but sadly, that just makes things even more confusing. Here is the map:

DN 12                          DN 2
======                       ======
20-55 (36 sections)	    40-76 (37 sections, beginning thru 1st absorption)
56-62 ( 7 sections)	    77-82 ( 6 sections, 2nd thru 4th absorptions)
63-77 (15 sections)	    83-98 (16 sections, K&V thru the final refrain)

So it’s only a little wonky. We’re allocated one section number less than we need for the first and last ranges, and one more than we need for the middle one. Usually we don’t restore the 12th and final refrain, because it’s after the elision ends, but in this case it’s assigned to one of the hyphenated section numbers, so we need one more section number there than whoever did this thought. I have no such theories about how they came up short on the first batch.

We do have the extra allocated section number available in 56-62, so we have a decision to make. We can either:

  1. ignore it and just not use one of the allocated section numbers (skipping it), which would be weird, or
  2. use it, by picking a DN 2 section to split in two, allocating the first half and second half to two different section numbers, which would also be weird (because these are the sections on the 2nd through 4th absorptions, which are very short), or
  3. use it to pad out one of the other ranges so we have one less pair of sections to fuse, thereby either mapping some segments labeled 20-55 to section 56, or else some labeled 63-77 to section 62, which might be even more confusing than either of the above possibilities.

So, I ask everyone reading this, which of the following would be least confusing to you in an expanded (elision-restored) version of Ven Sujato’s translation of DN 12?

  1. A mysteriously skipped section number among the jhānas sections.
  2. Segment DN 2:78.4 (or rather, the DN 12 refrain corresponding to it, end of 2nd absorption section) getting assigned to its own section number, different from that of the three preceding segments.
  3. Having DN 12:20-55.4 & 5 (1st absorption refrain) ending up in section 56, or alternatively
  4. Having DN 12:63-77.2 and the blank segment before it (beginning of Knowledge & Vision section) ending up in section 62.

I believe those are the available options with this current segment numbering.

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2

I’ve edited that one enough already, so I’m just chiming in to say that while there are other suttas which, like DN 2, have the simile of the transparent, clear, unclouded lake interposed between “there is nothing further for this place” and the 12th and final refrain, Lohiccasutta is not one of those, so we aren’t actually short a section in the last group. (That is, we don’t need to map anything to DN 2’s section 98: we just tack the final refrain onto the end of the section that maps to 97.)

This doesn’t change much about the above discussion: the basic problem is that section 56 was misallocated to the second batch instead of the first, and everything else stays the same.

Option 4 goes away, though. And knowing that this is the basic problem makes Option 3 assert itself much more dramatically as the obvious thing to do.

3

I don’t really have any responses to what you posted, however I appreciate the work you are doing.

If option 1 is clean and easy, I don’t see an inherent problem with skipped segment numbers. I’m guessing that even with the best and most well considered method it’s all going to look a bit hacked together.

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4

I ended up using a spreadsheet to solve this problem, clearly what I ought to have done in the first place, and I plan to make a table for each of the suttas with allocated section ranges (hyphenated section numbers in the segment IDs).

This whole process has been one of charging ahead, making mistakes, figuring out what I should have done in the first place, and doing that on the next pass.

I’m on the second pass now, and when I end up making two consecutive passes that produce identical maps and subst files, that’s when I’ll know it’s time to publish. After that I can start cataloging the long elisions in MN, because that’s probably where I’ll go after DN’s Sīlakhandhavagga. (I’ve just started studying the peyyālas in AN and SN, but I’ll definitely need more experience at this before tackling those ones.)

5

Are you aware of the Bilara i/o script for exporting scripts into csv files?

6

Yes, I’ve taken a look at it, and I’ll probably use one or some of those if I’m ever doing anything sophisticated enough to require it. I might already be using them if they were in Perl or Raku, but for some reason Python and my brain have never gotten along well with one another.

This isn’t that kind of spreadsheet anyway, it’s mostly just the two columns of parallel section numbers, with some columns for anchor segments and whatnot: very easily and quickly made by hand.

And yes, this probably means that when I write sample code to demo how to apply the json files I’m generating, what y’all will end up seeing will be what happens when I translate Raku into Python. I wouldn’t even attempt this except that I expect the code to be very simple, and if I don’t, I’m sure everyone is going to tell me that nobody uses Raku.

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