"He was a Hell of a Maker"

Listening to Luang Por Sumedho for years, I’ve several times heard him mention something about a Japanese equivalent for “Hell”, and shortly this is named as_no space_
And when contemplating this mysterious consept, I got a real sense for what that kind of hell would be like, and actually it’s Hellishness made me more uneasy than thinking about my good old christian warm as hell:slight_smile:
After some months or more the mind put together these few experiences, and presented them for me to chew on:

In my childhood days i spent a few hours in solitude in my room, and in a very dark state of mind. My activity was to empty all of my rage, pain, despair and “i don’t know what …” into a silent pillow. The reason was that I felt tortured by my own closest family and totally trapped in this situation. I lacked the physical strength to fight for my self, so i always ended up loosing every god damn thing.
During those “meditations” I managed to make a very special darkness, where the mind itself became darkness, and then dark saw and experienced it self as dark.
I remember that feeling of being totally exhausted into darkness, and that this darkness is the opposite of our normal dark behind closed eyes. It was empty of all but a shell of me, and me was still and resting in pure black.

Later in professional life I came to know a certain person who was under treatment at my place of work in the public Health care. They told me about this person, that he was special for the reason of becoming “black” when he went into depressions. When i asked for more information about how “black” would look like for me as a provider of the daily care, they only said: it’s impossible to explain this, you have to see it to understand …

So one day this person came home from school, and we where alone in the house. I was in the kitchen preparing dinner, and I heard the door open and somebody moving towards me, but i didn’t turn around to see. Then the sound of a chair being pulled from the table, and somebody sitting down.
Now I stopped in my activity and looked straight into the wall in front of me silent, and there a black nimitta arised, and i just watched this in silence wondering about it for a few seconds. When I turned my head, I saw this young person sitting there, and yes, now I could see and understand, and the only words coming out of my mouth was: it’s heavy now
And the person replied calmly “yes” …

This self made “Black hole” became later a center of gravity in the subconscious mind , where later bad feelings, intentions and deeds where put, and pressed firmly together. And when the pressure got to a certain point, the poison started to infect the whole of my mind, and i became being felt as possessed by a demon.


What happened later on? Long time ago it was?
Did you spoke some more with this kid?

And about hell aka no space, I am not sure if this could be linked somehow, but once one guy told me a story how he went into some hell realm after accidentally sliping on the ground and hitting with the head while being on full psychodelic mushroom trip.
This place he described as empty of “god”, of anything, forever, and he would not wish being there even for one second even for a Hitler.

Once when I was sick and being probably close to die, when I was fading away and the visual perception was becoming black and white, I also recollect feeling at that time something that I could probably describe as “god” or energy or I don’t know how to call it(that is all the time here in life and I was not realizing it) was ceasing and it was pretty terrifying and scary.

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Later on I had to face my demon, and that was about 6 years ago.

The first of memories forming this insight was more than 50 years ago, - the second about 10 years, and the last I heard from that kid was a year after being let out of care, and then it seamed okay.
But as I have my own experiences with forces like that, so I guess something had to be done for that poor creature in the future too …

Maybe there is a few of us harboring forces like that, and that karma decides if one will meet one’s own creations in this life or another, brought on by extreme suffering as in my case, by substances like “acid”, or some other cause. It is impossible to live a normal life with forces like that inside …

The feeling of living with a active black hole inside, is that with heightened pressure, the stronger gravity force - and the more one fights it, the stronger and more visible it gets. No light, no space, just cool rage

Could it be that it is the same energy that is taken to be good or bad, but is actually just energy?

The hell I made was so tight and suffocating because everything is to the core BLACK! Not like our childish scary woho dark, but “NO LIGHT” - and it meant to me: I’m dead but still here


I wonder…when seeing dark:

The dark is not mine.
I am not the dark.
The dark is not my self.


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It was long before I understood that there is no inside or outsider, and that both is equally unreal.
And I didn’t look for others world, but still had to face it as it arises. Now it’s "normal, and I’m more than once had to face forces like that in different jobs later, and in these days there are a former demon lurking around here where i live. He has been testing me in both world, so I guess he wants a word with me. He is someone i cared for a year back, and I thought i was done with that nasty creature. But then karma kicks in, because state run healt care has put up a single-patient project as my closest neighbor. This is a person that runs freely all over “The place”. Even the Police has given up.

If normal people could see these forces, they would be very very scared …
But we do know a nice medisin, so for us it’s a bit easier i guess, but one have to keep it inside the framework of the teachings, or else one becomes available dead meat

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Interesting to read @awarewolf. I’ve experienced similar things, and unsurprisingly similar childhood experiences.
I called this place you are describing the abyss… a bottomless black hole, so deep it was like the core of the planet. I also had the final show-down with the deamon/s… I won’t go into any details here, but if you want to discuss further send me a PM .

What I do want to say though, is that while it is the most terrifying experience (beyond ones imagination), it is possible to conquer it and to render it harmless. I probably worked on it for 20 years consciously, and then it was exacerbated in a life and death situation over a 5 year period, after which it was dispelled. This was a major plank in my journey in the Dhamma. I now look back on it as having resided in a mind-made hell. It is a terrifying place…
But, by knowing mind, and by training one can be free of mind made hell.

I have now been completely free of the deamons for over 15 years :slight_smile:

It feels like it was an ‘ordeal’ through suffering like in medieval folk tales. But I see it as a complete blessing - it highlights the mechanics of mind-made realities and allows one to ‘disconnect’.



By the way of subject of subconsciousness, meeting own demons etc. - have you heard about the shadow concept? - wikipedia

Some IMHO good example talk on this matter by lovely lady Ann Shulgin (30 min)
Ann Shulgin Q&A Session: “Understanding the Shadow”

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About four years ago I wrote an essay about my experiences, got it proofread by a kind bhikkhu, and sent it to my family - I called it “Shadow”
So this is highly interesting , and thanks friend @nikt

I’m gonna have a look at this video to :slight_smile:

Btw: Anybody heard about the possibility of energizing one’s own shadow and animate it? …

Anumodana sadhu sadhu sadhu :anjal: @nikt - that was a close enough for a cigar, so hats off my friend for making the power of kalyana mittas to come alive. This video gave me a few important pieces of information for my further pathwalking One of the books mentioned was part of knowledge, and I can confirm like her that this is real enough, and has some very interesting point for those who like to discover some more about “real power”.

Here is a picture i have let tag along for a while … been looking at it with both fascination and tinsy bit repulse, but decided that mostly it is me, and when i tune in to my beast and become the beast, I get a very clear vision to what I must take care of for any cost at all, and also remember that I am very big and powerful (much more than this little tiny meditator can handle “alone” …!?!) …

When I was 4 or 5 years old, I almost got trampled and possibly killed by a bull that suddenly attacked me when he saw me alone in the field. Just a miracle movement from a rather “round” Grandmother, moving like a cat , and trowing herself between me and this mad bull in the last second, prevented a sudden stop to this oddity:slight_smile:

I’m also born in the year of the Ox, Metal Ox, more precisely.

When I was about 5 or 6 years old I witnessed the slaughter of a big and very fine animal - he was so kind and nice, I loved that ox … And I stood looking into the eyes of this beast when they fired the bullet into his brain, and I saw with horror that “the light” went out of the eyes, and felt so sorry for us killing this nice nice animal. Can’t remember if I ever ate some if it’s remains …

Looking back at it it was the best thing that could have happened, and also so uneccesery to have to go through, before one lands on “it had to hurt this much or else your dreaming would go on and on” - it was perfect!

I said out loud: This is Hell!

Next thought: I can’t trust anything that goes on in my mind, anything …

Next thought: I’m stuck!

Next: I give up!

Next: I won’t move!

Next: I will only listen to my heart from now on!


6 months of emptiness without demons and just bits and pieces of a person the battle has left, followed … Saw or was presented with the three characteristics in an ongoing stream of effortless being, and i really thought I’ve reached “it”, without naming “it” … This went on until a natural turning away from the normal world arised, - distractions started to stick and efforts must be made, time to find out, and then the heart led me to this place.

The reason that this simple “mantra” did it for me, has puzzled me a bit, because it took such a profound bit of “my self” in just one go, without effort at all, just this clear knowing: I am in Hell!

So, then one thinks that could the cause for instant freedom be that mind recognized something already know to it, - like me in this physical body don’t need to think before removing my finger from a hot plate. “Letting go’s” by considered practice after the first one, is not like that to me, it’s more of an effort and the result feels more “wobbly” to me …

And if this was a Hellish knowing, it indicates that I have been to places like that before.

Sign and countersign

Have a nice day! :slight_smile:

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This very important, very very … because you are putting harm directly on to your self if you lash out - and if you run, you got to keep on running, and if you freeze, you let him have his way …

Love it to death!

Treat demons like people!

Later when one sits and share a drink with the Beast beside the Lava pool,
I say: You really scared the hell out of me! …, and the Beast goes: Me too!

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