Isn’t ending of rebirth desire for non-existence?

How early does ending of rebirth seem to truly start in earliest texts? Which ones?

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This was said by the Buddha, the Perfected One: that is what I heard.

“Overcome by two misconceptions, mendicants, some gods and humans get stuck, some overreach, while those with vision see.

And how do some get stuck? Because of love, delight, and enjoyment of existence, when the Dhamma is being taught for the cessation of existence, the minds of some gods and humans are not eager, confident, settled, and decided. That is how some get stuck.

And how do some overreach? Some, becoming horrified, repelled, and disgusted with existence, delight in ending existence: ‘When this self is annihilated and destroyed when the body breaks up, and doesn’t exist after death: that is peaceful, that is sublime, that is reality.’ That is how some overreach.

And how do those with vision see? It’s when a mendicant sees what has come to be as having come to be. Seeing this, they are practicing for disillusionment, dispassion, and cessation regarding what has come to be. That is how those with vision see.”

That is what the Buddha said. On this it is said:

“Those who see what has come to be as having come to be,
transcending what has come to be,
are freed in accord with the truth,
with the ending of craving for continued existence.

They completely understand what has come to be,
rid of craving for rebirth in this or that state,
with the disappearance of what has come to be,
a mendicant does not come back to future lives.”

This too was spoken by the Blessed One: that is what I heard


From my understanding, the answer to your question in the title (rather than the question in your post) is … No. Desire for non-existence is insisting that there is no rebirth. If the unenlightened mind maintains that there is no future lives, even though the Buddha insists that there is, then from the Buddhas perspective, that unenlightened mind desires just this one life and no more.

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Bhante can there be futher elaboration please ? What do earliest texts focus on?

In the Chapter of Eights, the end of desire for rebirth is explicitly mentioned, but not an end to rebirth. There is a difference between the two.

Also, one of the questions the Buddha will not answer is if the Buddha will exist or not after death which, I think, could arguably be interpreted as implying even the Buddha might be subject to rebirth.

I, personally, believe he was saying accept things as they are or will be.

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Kinda understanding. In that way. Ok. I see Buddha middle path.

Attainment of Brahma through the middle

Yes. I always considered that.

Maybe this has to happen natural.

minds are dispassionate toward future existence.”

Excerpt From
The Suttanipata

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“II The Minor Chapter

Question: Isn’t ending of rebirth desire for non-existence?
Answer: No. The Buddha taught us to “desire for non-suffering by following his Teaching, therefore, we can put an end to suffering”. The Buddha DID NOT teach us to “desire for non-existence by following his Teaching, therefore, we can put an end to existence”.

Please see the following quote from MN22:

As I am not, as I do not proclaim, so have I been baselessly, vainly, falsely, and wrongly misrepresented by some recluses and brahmins thus: ‘The recluse Gotama is one who leads astray; he teaches the annihilation, the destruction, the extermination of an existing being.’

Bhikkhus, both formerly and now what I teach is suffering and the cessation of suffering.


@Upasaka_Dhammasara , I think we practice mindfulness and samadhi for this purpose. Seeing the ceasing and arising of the world/namarupa contributes to this end.

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I think one can best look into ones own heart to decide what is really going on there. And also see if this is light or dark. What really drives you? How does that feel for you regardless of Buddhism or any religion?

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Exactly my friend. That’s what I’m at now. That mental attitude made me recently really consider meditating again. We can see for ourselves. :pray:t4:

For picking up and putting down is not what they do