Old vs Contemporary Translations for Samadhi/Jhāna

Discussion
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One thing I don’t understand with the discussion around Concentration is that, what you just said is what’s implied with Concentration for me. :slight_smile:

I understand that for some, it might have this image pop in their mind when they hear concentration:

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And that’s a peculiarity of English, that the word can be used both in an action and a state sense. :slight_smile:

But, in chemistry, concentration is literally just something being rid of impurities. It’s the end-state: “Rose oil concentration” is just Rose Oil rid of impurities (a state, not an action).

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When someone says “I’ve concentrated hard on my exam”, to me that implies they’ve removed everything else other than the exam.

And while Stillness is an important part of Samādhi practice, I find Ajahn Brahm’s translation deviating far from what Samādhi as a word (and practice) actually implies. :slight_smile:

Because I think there’s argument to be made that stillness (samatha or passambhati) is a condition for Samādhi, rather than being the thing itself. :slight_smile:

When your mind is full of rapture you need not make a wish: ‘May my body become tranquil!’ It’s only natural that your body becomes tranquil when your mind is full of rapture.

When your body is tranquil you need not make a wish: ‘May I feel bliss!’ It’s only natural to feel bliss when your body is tranquil.

When you feel bliss you need not make a wish: ‘May my mind be immersed in samādhi!’ It’s only natural for the mind to become immersed in samādhi when you feel bliss. AN 11.2

So we could say tranquility (or in other words, stillness) is a condition for bliss, which is a condition for Samādhi.

Otherwise, if we’re to say “Samādhi is stillness”, we might as well say “Ethical behaviour is Samādhi”, and just lose the function of the word completely. :slight_smile:

I’m just pointing out that for many, concentration, used in its more straightforward literal and everyday sense, works just fine for the “having let go, being rid of impurities” sense of the Samādhi. Which is why it’s still my preferred English translation for Samādhi. :slight_smile:

If I had to go arcane with words that might just fit, Collectedness, Composure would be some of the fancier things that just might work. I especially like the last one. :slight_smile:

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The four elements of Gautama’s “mindfulness of mind”, in F. L. Woodward’s Pali Text Society translation of SN 54.1:

Aware of mind I shall breathe in. Aware of mind I shall breathe out.

(One) makes up one’s mind:

Gladdening my mind I shall breathe in. Gladdening my mind I shall breathe out.

Composing my mind I shall breathe in. Composing my mind I shall breathe out.

Detaching my mind I shall breathe in. Detaching my mind I shall breathe out.

(SN 54.1, tr. Pali Text Society vol V pp 275-276)

That would argue for “composing the mind” as a step that takes place in the first concentration.

Why do I say “in the first concentration”? Because we know that the fundamental characteristic of concentration is “one-pointedness”

And what… is the (noble) right concentration with the causal associations, with the accompaniments? It is right view, right purpose, right speech, right action, right mode of livelihood, right endeavor, right mindfulness. Whatever one-pointedness of mind is accompanied by these seven components, this… is called the (noble) right concentration with the causal associations and the accompaniments.

(MN 117, © Pali Text Society vol III p 114; “noble” substituted for Ariyan; emphasis added)

And we know that Gautama returned to “one-pointedness” after he spoke:

And I… at the close of (instructional discourse), steady, calm, make one-pointed and concentrate my mind subjectively in that first characteristic of concentration in which I ever constantly abide.

(MN 36, © Pali Text Society vol I p 303)

Gautama described the mindfulness of SN 54, which is the same as that in Anapanasati, as his way of living before enlightenment (SN 54.8) and after enlightenment (SN 54.11), and also as his way of living (“dwelling”) during the rains residence.

Then the Blessed One, having emerged from seclusion after the passing of three months, addressed the monks: “Monks, if wanderers of other sects ask you, ‘By means of what dwelling, friends, did Gotama the contemplative mostly dwell during the rains residence?’: You, thus asked, should answer them in this way: ‘It was by means of the concentration of mindfulness of breathing that the Blessed One mostly dwelled.’

(SN 54.11, tr. Thanissaro Bhikkyu)

Although he never said so, that makes the mindfulness outlined in SN 54 and in Anapanasati the thought initial and sustained of the concentration that Gautama returned to “during the rains residence”.

Meanwhile–

I think I’ve answered my own question, on Sujato’s translation: it’s what the Pali Text Society’s Horner translated as “thought initial and sustained” that Sujato is translating as “the placing of the mind and keeping it connected“.

Where the Pali Text Society has:

Herein… the (noble) disciple, making self-surrender the object of (their) thought, lays hold of concentration, lays hold of one-pointedness. (The disciple), aloof from sensuality, aloof from evil conditions, enters on the first trance, which is accompanied by thought initial and sustained, which is born of solitude, easeful and zestful, and abides therein.

(SN 48.10, © Pali Text Society vol V p 174; “noble” substituted for Ariyan; Horner’s “initial” (MN 119) substituted for Woodward’s “directed”)

Thanissaro translates:

And what is the faculty of concentration? There is the case where a monk, a disciple of the noble ones, making it his object to let go, attains concentration, attains singleness of mind. Quite withdrawn from sensuality, withdrawn from unskillful mental qualities, he enters & remains in the first jhana: rapture & pleasure born from withdrawal, accompanied by directed thought & evaluation.

And Sujato has:

And what is the faculty of immersion? It’s when a noble disciple, relying on letting go, gains immersion, gains unification of mind. Quite secluded from sensual pleasures, secluded from unskillful qualities, they enter and remain in the first absorption, which has the rapture and bliss born of seclusion, while placing the mind and keeping it connected.

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Can you give examples of suttas where citta is used and examples of suttas where mana is used?

Thank you.

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Gautama said:

And what… is the (noble) right concentration with the causal associations, with the accompaniments? It is right view, right purpose, right speech, right action, right mode of livelihood, right endeavor, right mindfulness. Whatever one-pointedness of mind is accompanied by these seven components, this… is called the (noble) right concentration with the causal associations and the accompaniments.

(MN 117, © Pali Text Society vol III p 114; “noble” substituted for Ariyan; emphasis added)

Dogen wrote:

… I think there’s argument to be made that stillness (samatha or passambhati) is a condition for Samādhi, rather than being the thing itself.

Can we not agree that “stillness” is the absence of will or volition with regard to activity?

I collected the references:

It is intention that I call deeds. For after making a choice one acts by way of body, speech, and mind.

(AN 6.63, tr. Sujato)

And what are choices? There are three kinds of choices. Choices by way of body, speech, and mind. These are called choices.

(SN 12.2, tr. Sujato)

And what is the cessation of deeds? When you experience freedom due to the cessation of deeds by body, speech, and mind. This is called the cessation of deeds.

(SN 35.146, tr. Sujato)

… I have also explained the progressive cessation of activities. For someone who has attained the first absorption, speech has ceased. For someone who has attained the second absorption, the placing of the mind and keeping it connected have ceased. For someone who has attained the third absorption, rapture has ceased. For someone who has attained the fourth absorption, breathing has ceased. For someone who has attained the dimension of infinite space, the perception of form has ceased. For someone who has attained the dimension of infinite consciousness, the perception of the dimension of infinite space has ceased. For someone who has attained the dimension of nothingness, the perception of the dimension of infinite consciousness has ceased. For someone who has attained the dimension of neither perception nor non-perception, the perception of the dimension of nothingness has ceased. For someone who has attained the cessation of perception and feeling, perception and feeling have ceased. For a mendicant who has ended the defilements, greed, hate, and delusion have ceased.

(SN 36.11, tr. Sujato)

Yes, Gautama said “Breathing has ceased”, not deeds of the body have ceased, yet I think the latter is implied. Similarly, “the cessation of perception and feeling” implies the cessation of deeds of the mind.

The method for the abandonment of the exercise of choice in deeds is concentration, the four material jhanas, the four immaterial jhanas, and the “signless” concentration that follows the four immaterial jhanas.

I would say that “stillness” is a good word to represent the abandonment of volition in activity, but the aim is more “self-surrender” than “stillness”:

Herein… the (noble) disciple, making self-surrender the object of (their) thought, lays hold of concentration, lays hold of one-pointedness. (The disciple), aloof from sensuality, aloof from evil conditions, enters on the first trance, which is accompanied by thought initial and sustained, which is born of solitude, easeful and zestful, and abides therein.

(SN 48.10, © Pali Text Society vol V p 174; “noble” substituted for Ariyan; Horner’s “initial” {MN 119} substituted for Woodward’s “directed”)

Again, I believe the difficulty is in the sustained witness of involuntary activity of the body, and in particular in the sustained witness of involuntary activity of the body in inhalation and exhalation, “the cessation of inbreathing and outbreathing” that marks the fourth concentration. The descriptions Gautama gave of the extension of ease, and of the extension of a “pureness by the purity of the mind” allow the sustained witness of such activity.

So, yes, stillness, and the cessation of voluntary and habitual activity beginning with the activity of speech, and proceeding to a similar cessation with regard to inhalation and exhalation, yet not the cessation of automatic or “reflex” activity in the body. Because that’s the case, “stillness” could be misleading.

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For example:

Another examples of mana:

  • MN27 in guarding the sense doors mana is used.
  • MN2 rational application of mind
  • MN38 manovinnana
  • MN40 mind full or rapture
  • MN41 threefold principled and moral conduct by way of mind

Example of citta:

  • MN5 rāga, dosa, moha are corruptions of citta. MN7 lists additional ones.
  • MN10 3rd mindfullness is about citta
  • MN62 Advice to Rahula, disinterestedness, detachment of citta from elements
  • MN16 Emotional Barrenness of citta
  • MN128 lists subtle citta imperfections

MN36 states that for undeveloped citta, painful feelings occupy it - thus this Sutta seems to tells us that citta is more about feelings.

Because their physical endurance is undeveloped, pleasant feelings occupy the citta(heart). And because their citta(heart) is undeveloped, painful feelings occupy the heart(citta).

There are plenty other examples, I also quoted some of your recent quotes to point our which one is which, but this can be easily seen in sutta by enabling English and Pali view (keyboard shortcut ‘v’).

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Thanks very much, am7.

Hopefully I can be more aware of that going forward–I don’t know exactly what to make of it at the moment, but I’ll keep an eye out in the future!

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Rereading your examples, am7, I find myself leaping to the conclusion that “mana” is the mind of thought, and citta the equivalent of consciousness.

I had no idea there was such a distinction in the teachings, thank you for drawing my attention to it and for the extensive examples.

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Your welcome, that’s what I intended to do - to point out the distinction for better understanding of samadhi/jhana topic.

I don’t know what meaning “consciousness” holds for you. It can be yet another problematic word. It can mean: 1.being conscious - not asleep 2. translation of viññāṇa (viññāṇa ~ distinguishing knowledge) 3. something else
Currently people mostly use that word for viññāṇa here. Although, personally, I currently consider viññāṇa as “distinguishing|discerning knowledge” as the base word ñāṇa means knowledge and Suttas differentiate between different kinds of knowledge and different instructions towards them: eg. aggregate kind of knowledge is to be completely understood while the other kind of knowledge is to be cultivated.

  • vedana (lit. causing to know) - common translation: feeling, 2nd aggregate
  • saññā (lit. knowing together) - common translation: perception, 3rd aggregate
  • viññāṇa - common translation: consciousness, 5th aggregate
  • pañña - common translation: wisdom, 5th spiritual faculty
  • abhiñña - common translation: higher knowledge
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Fantastic, am7, that’s great information for me.

viññāṇa, the Pali Text society does translate the 5th aggregate as consciousness, as does Bhikkyu Sujato (SN 22.45).

Interesting to me is the difference between the fifth aggregate and the fourth aspect of mindfulness. Rhys Davids translated that fourth aspect as “ideas”, I see that Sujato has translated it as “principles”, Horner in her Majjhima translations put forward “states of mind”.

In SN 54, the chapter on inbreathing and outbreathing, Gautama summarizes the fourth category of mindfulness without ever naming it, as far as I can tell:

(One) makes up one’s mind:

Contemplating impermanence I shall breathe in. Contemplating impermanence I shall breathe out.
Contemplating dispassion I shall breathe in. Contemplating dispassion I shall breathe out.
Contemplating cessation I shall breathe in. Contemplating cessation I shall breathe out.
Contemplating renunciation I shall breathe in. Contemplating renunciation I shall breathe out.

(SN 54.1, tr. Pali Text Society vol V pp 275-276)

That doesn’t sound like ideas, or principles to me–more like Horner’s “state of mind”. That plays well against “consciousness” as the fifth aggregate of graspings, I think–the grasping of a state of mind.

Anyway, thanks very much for the breakdown on “consciousness” in Pali terms.

My concern is mostly with cittass’ek’aggatā (Thanissaro, from his “How Pointy is One-Pointedness”), evidently the singularity of consciousness that follows “making self-surrender the object of thought” (SN 48.10, tr. Pali Text Society vol V p 174)–a singularity of citta?

Sujato evidently translates “cittassa ekaggataṁ” as “unification of mind”, in SN 48.10. I think I like the Pali Text Society and Thanissaro’s translation better, as “one-pointedness of mind”. A critical translation, because as Thanissaro pointed out:

A Pāli sutta, MN 44, defines concentration as cittass’ek’aggatā, which is often translated as “one-pointedness of mind”: cittassa = “of the mind” or “of the heart,” eka = one, agga = point, -tā = -ness. MN 117 defines noble right concentration as any one-pointedness of mind supported by the first seven factors of the noble path, from right view through right mindfulness. MN 43 states further that one-pointedness is a factor of the first jhāna, the beginning level of right concentration.

(How Pointy is One-pointedness?, Thanissaro Bhikkyu)

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Yes, SN54.1 is shorter than MN10, where the forth mindfulness is dhamma + anupassī. Then in other suttas mana(mind) is defined as internal sense field, and dhamma as external sense field. (eg,: eye and sight, ear and sound… mind and dhamma). Some translate it as mental phenomena, ideas, states of mind, principles, etc. With regards to viññāṇa and 4th mindfulness, in fact all 5 aggregates are included under it. MN10#38.2

Yes there is not a mention of vinnana but citta in the verse.

Idha, bhikkhave, ariyasāvako vossaggārammaṇaṁ karitvā labhati samādhiṁ, labhati cittassa ekaggataṁ.
It’s when a noble disciple, relying on letting go, gains immersion, gains unification of heart.

By “making self-surrender the object of thought” there is vossaggārammaṇaṁ . I haven’t studied this word in detail, thou my first observation is that it contains the word mana and not dhamma, thou it might be just a coincidence.

For understanding ekaggacitto MN29 might be a bit helpful in that it presents the opposite word to ekaggacitto, vibbhantacittā (wavering, roaming, straying, lit. dividing apart):

And they glorify themselves and put others down on account of that:
‘I’m the one with immersion and unified heart (ekaggacitto). These other mendicants lack immersion, they have straying hearts (vibbhantacittā) .’

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Thanks, am7–food for thought.

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Venerable Kumāra Bhikkhu has written a wonderful book that clarified a great deal regarding this thread’s title and your question. Rather than misquote or under-represent the book, I recommend you read it; it is here: What You Might Not Know about Jhāna & Samādhi

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Thanks for the recommendation. I read the book as far as his discussion of “one-pointedness”. Here’s Thanissaro Bhikkyu’s introduction to the term:

A Pali sutta, MN 44, defines concentration as cittass’ek’aggatā, which is often translated as “one-pointedness of mind”: cittassa = “of the mind” or “of the heart,” eka = one, agga = point, -tā = -ness. MN 117 defines noble right concentration as any one-pointedness of mind supported by the first seven factors of the noble path, from right view through right mindfulness. MN 43 states further that one-pointedness is a factor of the first jhāna, the beginning level of right concentration.

(How Pointy is One-Pointedness)

Indeed, Thanissaro concludes that “one-pointedness” is attention to an object, and he advises:

Show your lack of contempt for your meditation object by giving it your full attention and mastering concentration.

(ibid)

Venerable Kumāra Bhikkhu in his book writes:

Ekaggacitta has three parts: eka (one) + agga + citta (mind). When a translator renders ekaggatā as “one-pointedness”, he would have to render ekaggacitta as “one-pointed mind”, which you may have seen. “One-pointed mind”—what does it mean? It is an odd expression, not understandable in normal English.

I beg to differ.

Here’s another way of looking at “one-pointedness”, from my experience:

… “one-pointedness” occurs when the movement of breath necessitates the placement of attention at a singular location in the body, and a person “lays hold of one-pointedness” when they remain awake as the singular location shifts.

( Just to Sit)

I find support from modern neurobiology, which speaks of “the experience that the self is localized at a specific position in space within one’s bodily borders”:

A key aspect of the bodily self is self-location, the experience that the self is localized at a specific position in space within one’s bodily borders (embodied self-location).

(Journal of Neuroscience 26 May 2010, 30 (21) 7202-7214)

The connection to the four concentrations is direct. Important to note that “laying hold of one-pointedness” and the subsequent first concentration depends on “making self-surrender the object of thought”:

In Gautama’s description of the first concentration, concentration begins when a person lays hold of “one-pointedness”, something Gautama also referred to as “one-pointedness of mind”. Translated into the language of the neurobiologists, concentration begins when consciousness is retained at the “specific position in space” of “embodied self-location”.

… The zest and ease of the initial concentration are a result of the effortlessness of the automatic activity initiated by gravity where one-pointedness of mind takes place. To drench the entire body with the feelings of zest and ease such that “there is not one particle of the body that is not pervaded” ensures that the consciousness retained with “embodied self-location” can remain “one-pointed”, even as the “specific position” of “embodied self-location” shifts and moves.

There can come a moment when the experience of consciousness retained with “embodied self-location” becomes the experience of “embodied self-location” retained with consciousness.

… (one suffuses one’s) body with purity by the pureness of (one’s) mind so that there is not one particle of the body that is not pervaded with purity by the pureness of (one’s) mind.

(AN 5.28, tr. Pali Text Society vol. III pp 18-19)

The “purity” that suffuses the body is the pureness of the mind without any will or intention with regard to the body.

… “Doing something” with regard to the body or the breath, whether “known and deliberate” or “concealed from the consciousness by habit” (quoting Moshe Feldenkrais’s “Awareness through Movement”), has ceased.

(The Place Where You Stop and Rest)

I’ll see if I can find Kumāra Bhikkhu’s email, and alert him. Thanks for the reference, I found his distinction between the jhanas of EBT and the jhanas of the Vissudhimagga and modern Theravadan teaching revealing.