Probability of our civilisation to survive without facing a catastrophic collapse estimated at less than 10% in most optimistic scenario

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I remember reading about Dr Pachauri in the newspapers. Memory is a funny thing :thinking: :grimacing:. I remember the scandal and the trial by media as well as his resignation. But I have zero recollection of his having being cleared by the investigation committee or of his having won his libel cases!

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Yes, I saw this one. The ice sheet collapse in particular seems to consistently outpace projections, yet the climate models are still using older data. Even the latest IPCC projections don’t keep up with the data. We’ll see how this affects the next major IPCC report, which I believe is due in 2022. No doubt Covid-19 will make that deadline harder to keep.

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It seems that even the self regulating mechanisms were broken by us…

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There’s been some truly devastating news recently.

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Sadly this is a real risk…

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And not to compete in the “most horrifying news” category, but this was one of the most powerful and devastating pieces I’ve read. It’s a few months old, and doesn’t really contain new science, but it is a very raw assessment by some of the very best scientists in the field.

And also a recent article by Tim Flannery, who is always on point.

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Here’s a blast from the past, “After the Warming” hosted by James Burke. The miniseries debuted in 1989. I remember watching the end of it in a hotel room in the mid-90s while traveled cross-country. I thought it was over-optimistic when I saw it then. It was presenting global warming (remember when we called it “global warming” before politicians managed to get everyone to talk about “climate change” instead?) in a future-looking-back perspective to educate people about what was happening and what could be done about it.

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Although “global warming” is not anymore a welcome term one thing is for sure, there is warming going on in the oceans.
Given the scale of the volumes involved one can only imagine the humongous amount of energy we are causing to be retained in these waters. What the consequences of that will be ?

Surely weather - which to a great extent is about how overall air and water vapour interact - will be affected! :grimacing:

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It’s even in Canada. I have a friend from university who was a “true believer” in PizzaGate, the nonsense about Hillary Clinton and the DNC allegedly engaging in supposed Sumerian religion that involved baby-eating and molestation for Satan. He hardcore believed this pizza joint was the centre of a globalist cabal of “cultural Marxists.”

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I’m so sorry! And that these ideas are now among the educated. How thin the veneer of reason truly is. We are seeing an extremely dangerous mental contagion, as even the intelligent and educated are gripped by powerful forces of chaos and malevolence erupting from the dark side of the irrational.

In such times we must cling to reason, to community, to compassion, to all the things that are the wellsprings of mental health and human flourishing.

Meanwhile the news from the environment continues to disturb. The reality is heightening the fever, and the power of reason to make sense of it all is failing.

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One thing about complex and chaotic systems is that these involve tipping points, critical masses and causalities beyond what can be comprehended or summarised in simple constant rulesets.

By looking at earth from space and seeing the scale and speed in which we are bringing unnatural changes to the complex weather and ecological systems on this little wet rock earth his I can only be sure we are pushing things beyond its normal states and rate of change…

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Hi @Gabriel_L I did see the urgency of establishing in practice, at least minimum to becoming skilled to enter in jhanas, of-course to become successful in practice. IMO, I cannot relate the reason for urgency to prediction of civilisation survival. The more I think about these predictions the more restless I become because I am feeding restlessness.

Bhikkhus, whatever a bhikkhu frequently thinks and ponders upon, that will become the inclination of his mind. - Snippet from MN19

The definition of Right Livelihood by Bhante Vimalaramsi made me more sense. He calls Harmonious Lifestyle, means it’s important what you keep in front of your mind during the daily activity. If we keep things uplifting, it’s beneficial.

I had done an experiment of not reading news for sometime, I found myself much harmony. Later I realised that, meditation is not just while we are sitting, Meditation is life, Life is mediation, so it’s important what content I am feeding to my mind. There can be many contents (about predictions) which doesn’t helps us to keep our mind uplifted, so spending time on those stuff is not worth (ideally).

There is probability that the roof might fall down while I am writing this response, if I keep thinking about that it doesn’t going to help me. That’s why IMO there is urgency of practicing Dhamma, but reason for urgency is not prediction of civilisation survival.

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Fair enough! May we all be successful in our development and endeavours in the eightfold path! :anjal:

PS: This is a Watercooler post and if its contents annoy or disturb you, feel free to mute it. I do it all the time! :sweat_smile:

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I understand completely, I really do. But it seems that for many people, the opposite of “not reading news” is not “peace of mind”; it’s QAnon. Information is the antidote to delusion.

In the spirit of which,

This is not what right livelihood means. It means, “making a living (which for most people is their job) in a harmless way”.

It’s possible to present Dhamma in an engaging way without confusing basic concepts.

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I ask sorry for any confusion, Bhante Vimalaramsi definition does includes what you had mentioned, but it include more to it. Lee me share

SAMMA ᾹJĪVA" - Harmonious Lifestyle (or Right Livelihood): This has always been a curious part of the 8-Fold Path. The standard way of describing this has been not to kill living beings on purpose, not to sell poisons or weapons, and not to deal in slavery and selling human beings. But how does this relate directly to one’s meditation practice? If it is important enough to be put in the 8-Fold Path, then there must be more to it that leads to the cessation of suffering. Don’t you agree? These above things do give us this idea of Right Livelihood ( Harmonious Lifestyle )- in a general way, but just how does Harmonious Lifestyle (“Right Livelihood”) relate to our true understanding and practice? An interesting question, isn’t it? And it becomes even more interesting when we consider that the Buddha gave these instructions with the very first discourse that he gave to the Five Ascetics and he was showing them about the direct experience of meditation practice. These ascetics surely did not kill living beings, they didn’t sell poisons or weapons, or sell slaves – so what was the Buddha actually talking about when he mentioned Harmonious Lifestyle (Right Livelihood)?
When we take a look at mental development through the eyes of Harmonious Lifestyle (Right Livelihood), it may make a little more sense. For instance, Harmonious Lifestyle (Right Livelihood) means how we practice our observation ( Harmonious Observation Right Mindfulness) and meditation of the present moment during all of the times that we are not doing our sitting meditation (in other words our daily activities). We are practicing being in harmony with a mind that is alert, calm, joyful and uplifted ( Harmonious Movement and Harmonious Communication or Right Action and Right speech with ourselves -a short note this is why I encourage students to smile whether doing their sitting meditation or their daily activities). The trick is seeing how, when things are not going the “way I want them to” and mind becomes heavy with emotional issues (Unharmonious Movement or Wrong Action) – how the observation of how minds attention becomes weak and the subtle “I like it, I don’t like it” and thinking unwholesome thoughts (craving and clinging – unharmonious Communication or wrong speech) causes us even more suffering.
In other words, having a Harmonious Lifestyle (Right Livelihood) means that we learn to carry the meditation ( Harmonious Observation, Harmonious Communication, Harmonious Imaging, Harmonious Perspective, Harmonious Practice, Harmonious Collectedness and Harmonious Movement in other words the entire 8-Fold Path) with us all of the time, in our daily activities. In this way, we then truly begin to understand that the impersonal process of Dependent Origination ( Harmonious Perspective) is in everything that arises. Having a Harmonious Lifestyle (Right Livelihood) is having an uplifted happy mind that is smiling, joyful, alert and free from unwholesome thoughts, or feelings.
The emotions that are heavy and tend to pull mind away from the present moment, are the cause of suffering. Why? Because the meditator tends to take these thoughts and feelings personally, with the wrong perspective of “I am That” attitude. This personal perspective (wrong life style) in our daily lives is the reason that so many people suffer so much! Also, too many times when someone does a meditation retreat, the meditator gets very serious and heavy in mind without really recognizing it. The heavy distracted Unharmonious Lifestyle (wrong Livelihood) is the mind that is being caught by the personal (atta) belief ( Unharmonious Perspective ). They become distracted by opinions, concepts, thoughts, daydreaming and the general dissatisfactions of life. Or we can say that whenever mind has heavy emotional states in it, this is considered to be Unharmonious Lifestyle (Wrong Livelihood). This is the mind that is out of balance and gravitates toward unhappiness and suffering. When one is practicing the Harmonious Lifestyle (Right Livelihood) it makes all meditation and life a continuous flow of happiness that leads us toward the cessation of suffering. In this way, “Meditation is Life, Life is Meditation”!
Source: The 8-Fold Path in Practical Terms

Once again, this is simply not what the Buddha was talking about when he used the words “right livelihood”. What Vimalaramsi calls “the standard way” is simply what it says in the Suttas. It has nothing to do with having a “harmonious lifestyle” or with mindfully observing in every moment (which, if anything, belongs under right mindfulness). It has to do with making your living in a way that doesn’t cause harm.

What we do at work is a crucial determinant in who we are; we identify by our profession: “I am a monk”, “I am a waiter”, “I am a repo man”. It shapes how we spend most of the day, and in doing so, shapes our intention. A right livelihood gives us a sense of meaning, as our job is something that actually helps others. Someone who is a farmer, or a builder, or a doctor gets a palpable sense of meaning and accomplishment in serving others, whereas someone selling ads or poisons, for example, does not.

What Vimalaramsi is talking about is general mindfulness practice. Should a farmer try to be mindful when working? Sure, good on them! But that has nothing to do with the nature of the livelihood as such.

The problem with this is that “right livelihood” becomes divorced from the actual ethical consequences of your job. Anyone can try to be mindful while working for Evil Inc., and smile joyfully while they take pay from impoverished workers and give it to the executives, or keep “noble” silence while trillions of dollars of criminal money are funneled through the shiny bank they work at.

But wrong livelihood is corrosive. It eats your soul. It turns what should be a source of joy and meaning into a life-sapping dread. Once you get used to the money and the trappings, you start to ask yourself, “why am I doing this?” “How is this making the world a better place?” This is, of course, why modern corporations are full of internal motivational messaging, trying to keep their workers happily ignoring the consequences of what they are doing.

And let me be clear, this is by no means separate from the modern mindfulness movement. On the contrary, mindfulness training is frequently used in corporations for precisely this purpose. Employees are distressed, unfocused, unhappy? Let’s get them practicing mindfulness, that’ll help them to stay on track! CEOs are taught mindfulness so they will have the confidence to sack workers. Soldiers are taught mindfulness to help them get back to war.

So when we see that the Buddha did not emphasize being mindful while at work, but instead, emphasized understanding the harmful moral consequences of one’s work, this is not something to be dismissed lightly. It is something to be reflected on deeply, for the teachings of the Buddha are profound. They have meanings and nuances that last, that resonate, that fit in on a deeper level that is not always apparent on the surface.

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With due respect, I am accepting your explanation of Right livelihood. I agree that the ones living profession should not cause harm to others.

I have a humble last question, if a person is by birth have a body not supportive to take up any work and he is completely dependent on family/relatives/others. For such persons how Right Livelihood is applicable?

I created a new thread to discuss Right livelihood, as it is side tracking actual thread title. Please answer in thread

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“baby doomers”