Debuking Julius Evola and his influence on the AltRight

Yes sir I completely understood now what you are saying. I was completely wrong before when I said I did not see any wrongs in his book. Now I see it clearly because of you. Thank you for clarifying it. :ok_hand:

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No worries! I’m glad you understand, may you be free from suffering and always happy. :pray:

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Why only Julius Evola? There are innumerable Bad Ideas out there… belonging both to the Politically extreme Left as well as extreme Right. Fascists such as Hitler and Marxists such as Stalin use the same textbook of Hate to lead their nations into orgies of violence against the vilified “Other”.

If it was obvious that a Bad Idea was indeed a Bad Idea, most people would probably not take it up.

But a Bad Idea usually comes dressed up as a Good Idea. Indeed, it often has the germ of a Good Idea within it, but its Truth has been twisted. Bad Ideas promise much gain for little work while eventually delivering much pain - though this is not apparent when they are first examined. Good Ideas on the other hand, promise little and demand much work, though they eventually deliver much benefit!

Humans, being subject to Greed, Ill will and Delusion are invariably attracted to Bad Ideas far more than Good Ideas. :rofl:

The best advise here is that of the Buddha (MN61). If each person followed it, demagogues such as Julius Evola would have no support in the world.

When you want to act with the body/ speech/ mind, you should check on that same deed: ‘Does this act with the body that I want to do lead to hurting myself, hurting others, or hurting both? Is it unskillful, with suffering as its outcome and result?

While you are acting with the body/ speech/ mind, you should check on that same act: ‘Does this act with the body that I am doing lead to hurting myself, hurting others, or hurting both? Is it unskillful, with suffering as its outcome and result?

After you have acted with the body/ speech/ mind, you should check on that same act: ‘Does this act with the body that I have done lead to hurting myself, hurting others, or hurting both? Is it unskillful, with suffering as its outcome and result?

So Rāhula, you should train yourself like this: ‘I will purify my physical, verbal, and mental actions after repeatedly checking.’”

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Primarily because he’s a big person being passed around in alt-right circles as a source on buddhism!

This is a fair point! You bring up that hitler and Stalin are the same, this is a good point I think because it’s true. Whether we dress up fascism in democratic blue or conservative red, fascism is fascism all the same and will propagate essentially the same values no matter how it looks. It’s why saying the CCP is somehow different from Nazi germany simply because they claim to be socialist is so foolish. It’s fascism all the way down, much like the turtles! :grinning_face_with_smiling_eyes:

These are good points. I like the end quote as well.
That said, I don’t know where this is in the suttas but I believe Sariputta was praised for the quality of pointing out evil. I think we do good when we show that something is not the dharma.

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That’s the topic of the thread!!

(@faujidoc1 You’re a moderator and you’re sounding a bit like an apologist here, as well as derailing the focus of the thread.)

It’s because his writings have persistently been used by far right and neo nazi groups to invent a white supremacist version of Buddhism, which, due to ignorance and design, continues to have influence in Buddhist communities. There is genuine concern that these types of view are growing.

Bad ideas can’t just be magic-ed away, they need to be discussed and refuted.

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Hmmm, it was just a rhetorical flourish to open the post. And for the record I don’t agree with the philosophy of the alt - right, or with any philosophy of hate for that matter.

It’s just that, being Indian myself, I find the entire concept of my culture being co opted in these ways by an alien race downright ludicrous. How on earth can anyone get it all so wrong?

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I don’t think, Bhante, that they meant to sound any kind of way. But I understand your motivation and appreciate where it comes from. All is well and good here :slight_smile:

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Who is Julius evola ?

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Yes sir. I am reading his book right now. Omg how much misinterpretation! It’s very hard to say he is wrong when he is in fact wrong. His mistake is hiding behind his expressive knowledge. This proves it doesn’t matter if you are great scholar, only difference is You will do great scholarly mistakes which even you can’t see. I am glad I asked danamitra sir to clarify. Phew.

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A very deluded person, whose Wrong Views have led, and continue to lead many ordinary people to suffer in Hell, here and now.

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@Ratana
Sir if you are reading Julius evola’s book on buddhism or anything related to it. I would advice you to read all the replies to this thread along with it. Because Julius Evola’s views in his book about buddhism(that buddhism is in true sense anti-democratic, against universal benevolence, and so on), EBT are so alluring, like optical illusion and it’s hard to see that about them, they are actually wrong and delusional. Why would buddhism be anti-democratic, and against universal benevolence? Atleast to me when I started reading it…his views felt to be true. Moreover he says this is actually what Theraveda is all about. You can see his delusion. Problem is that he represents it so nicely that it feels as if he has got point…but it’s captivatingly misleading . And I understood that he is wrong only after it was clarified by everyone here. It was off course because of my lack of wisdom.
I just wanted to share this with you.

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I don’t recommend Buddhist boycotting his book because without knowing wrong view we would not know the real value of right view

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Furthermore, there is a history of Buddhists refuting other doctrines (including erroneous interpretations of Buddhism) through written and oral responses. The same could be done towards Julius Evola and his followers.

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The Buddha taught quite specifically that there is only one nobility, the nobility of the spirit. Perhaps another reader here can supply the reference to a conversation the Buddha had with a certain brahmin on this topic. Please?

I don’t have time to read JE I’m afraid, I’ll have to find time to read JE, but I’d like to comment that were I wishing to widely propagate a Bad idea, an early strategy would be to look for a Good idea to wrap it up in, so JE’s approach doesn’t surprise me: even tho it saddens me. (And think how many Bad ideas have been propagated in the name of religions that carrry Good messages.).

Imho, this is indubitably the best advice to apply as we consider appropriate ways of countering Bad ideas.

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It hasn’t happened so far in this thread :smiley: , but given how easily trolls can be attracted to threads that discuss countering Bad ideas, it’s worth reminding any newcomer to the thread that posting in support of any type of Alt-Right idea is never acceptable on this Forum. Posts will be removed and their posters suspended.

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11 posts were merged into an existing topic: Breakaway thread on “isms” and ideologies

I myself must disagree with this point, there is a sutta that escapes my mind currently, but it’s similar to the abhasita sutta. It tells about how to discuss someone who’s misrepresenting the dhamma, and specifies not to get angry but to draw distinctions and show that something that was said was not said at all.
This in mind, I think direct refutation can potentially be a good thing, if only it helps a few people instead of many.
This is my thought though, it’s possible that I’m subject to subtle clinging with this idea and not thinking it through.

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The type of people espousing and pushing Evola are the same people photographed doing nazi salutes to the Buddha, or who have YouTube channels full of interviews with nazis. Such people are the darlings of the alt right Buddhist movement.

It seems the alt right audience is growing. Agree to disagree?! Might not be enough…

I’m not going to comment on your interactions with other forum members here, but I don’t think your own response (which seems to me to be optimistically burying one’s head in the sand, hoping it goes away, not confronting these abhorrent idealogies, not rejecting them nor refuting them, and both-siding the argument with unrelated things instead of addressing the real and current concerns raised by the OP) is going to have the effect you desire either.

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This is going to be wildly off topic, but it feels pertinent. Responses like this and the attitude of you and Bhante Sujato are why I love this little community.
May all beings be happy.

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