Seeing faults in others / criticism

Discussion
1

Greetings to all and my respectful salutations to the members of the sangha.

In the context of fault finding, the sapurisasutta shows clearly how a good person doesn’t reveal another person’s bad points, and would do so not in full details, making omissions if pressed with questions.

Corroborated by this passage of the Dhammapada :

Let none find fault with others; let none see the omissions and commissions of others. But let one see one’s own acts, done and undone.

Verse 51

Yet, a few pages later, one can find this verse :

If one finds someone who points out faults and who reproves, one should follow such a wise and sagacious person as one would a guide to a hidden treasure. It is always better, and never worse, to cultivate such an association.

So one would be deemed wise and sagacious to point out the faults of another companion on the path, but the sapurisasutta suggests not to reveal another person’s bad points as the other Dhammapada verse suggests.

Is it the context of improvement and the intention to help the person that a sagacious person would mention the faults of another and thus making it wholesome ?

There is also the Pathamakatha sutta where the Buddha teaches the following :

Having investigated and scrutinized, he speaks dispraise of one who deserves dispraise. (2) Having investigated and scrutinized, he speaks praise of one who deserves praise. (3) Having investigated and scrutinized, he is suspicious about a matter that merits suspicion. (4) Having investigated and scrutinized, he believes a matter that merits belief. Possessing these four qualities, the wise, competent, good person preserves himself unmaimed and uninjured; he is blameless and beyond reproach by the wise; and he generates much merit.

There indeed seems to be a fine nuance amidst these different elements.
I would keenly appreciate your insights on this matter, if I may please ask for such.
Wishing you all well.

2 Likes
2

AN 10.44 records the Buddha’s advice on when to give criticism. You should check whether your mind is established in loving-kindness. Whether giving that advice would make you a hypocrite. How confident you are that the advice lines up with the dhamma and vinaya. And even then you should wait for the right time to speak.

Does that help answer your question?

7 Likes
3

This is for telling to a 3rd person.

This is for one’s own peace of mind and meditation improvements.

The one who points out is rare, because people may want to just focus on themselves, so it’s good to treasure those who would risk some discomfort for themselves to point out faults.

In a community, there tends to be some who’s the “vinaya police” and may become unpopular if their people skills are not good enough. Most of the rest just don’t want to get into trouble with others.

2 Likes
4

I think this sutta tangentially colors the issue:

https://suttacentral.net/mn21/en/sujato?lang=en&layout=plain&reference=none&notes=asterisk&highlight=false&script=latin

1 Like
5

Thank you so much for your answers bhantes, it made a lot of sense and these nuances that you have brought about helped me better understand these concepts, may you be well bhantes !

1 Like
6

Dear bhante, in the context of someone who has a reprehensible behaviour or who has grounds for criticism, would it be unwholesome to speak to another person of such ?
A very pragmatic example, today after going in a public area my father told me how the lady next to say said harsh things that could harm its child, I find it insightful as it is indeed unwholesome to do so, but it may not seem so much as pointing someone’s bad points as much as criticising someone for unproper behaviour.
Aren’t there lay disciples in the suttas criticising certain bhikkhus for their behaviours, and if so, is it unwholesome to do so too ?
May I ask what may your thoughts be on this bhantes ?

7

In most if not all rules, the origin story had monks of good behaviour and little desire criticized the behavior of those who got involved in actions which results in the establishment of a new rule.

So if done properly, with loving kindness and so on it is ok.

Just also practically know that some people are hard to admonish and one needs to take into account the time, place, mood, manner of presentation, even non violent communication, how often one gives negative feedback vs positive feedback, if oneself is freed from such faults, if oneself is well versed in the vinaya etc.

So many considerations, that it’s not an easy job to be vinaya police.

2 Likes
8

Thank you very much for your answer bhante :pray:

1 Like