Should you believe in rebirth? Whatever!

[Gabriel_L]

I’ll leave it to you to find out. This is starting to feel like trolling to me…

[anon31486827]

@Martin

you’d need to use later concepts like “store consciousness”.

Are you familiar with the concept of viññāṇasotaṃ (stream of consciousness) in DN28? Also the concept of bhavasotā (stream of existence) in Snp3.12.

[faujidoc1]

It was mentioned in the beginning of this discussion…

@faujidoc1

Let’s all keep in mind that the question of Rebirth without a Self is one of the metaphysical points generations of Buddhist philosophers have been discussing for 2500 years without a satisfactory outcome! We’re hardly likely to come up with the definitive answer on D&D!

It seems that we have once again, horror of horrors, failed to reach agreement!

This thread, which is already 265 posts long shall be closed soon. If anyone has anything fresh to say, which hasn’t already been said over the last 265 posts… welcome! Otherwise, let us take wise counsel in the Buddha who said…

Indeed the truth is one, there’s not another,
about this the One who Knows
does not dispute with another,
but the Samaṇas proclaim their varied “truths”
and so they speak not in the same way.

[tuvok]

@faujidoc1

This thread, which is already 265 posts long shall be closed soon.

I’m not sure, what’s the point of this topic-closing policy? I’m not asking specifically for this topic, rather more generally. As long as people are behaving, shouldn’t they be able to continue if they wish to? It’s not like anybody is forced to read or participate

[faujidoc1]

@tuvok

what’s the point of this topic-closing policy?

The issue is that topics on this forum are archived for later researchers and posters to read. When a thread approaches 250+ posts, it becomes difficult for fresh participants to read through those large number of posts. In the absence of fresh participants, the thread becomes restricted to 2-3 old participants and the same old concepts keep getting rehashed and trashed.

If there is any unique concept that participants feel has not yet been mentioned, they are welcome to go ahead and post on this thread before it is closed. If there is some concept that participants feel has not been adequately explored, they are welcome to start a new thread.

[Radius]

This will score me negative brownie points, but if popularity were my guiding beacon I wouldn’t be much of a Buddhist.

For what it’s worth, I didn’t feel that @Martin was trolling; being misunderstood is a terrible feeling. He asked questions that any rational (I’m assuming) Westerner will and should ask.

His first post…

@Martin

I haven’t yet found…

…indicates he’s been kicking this one around since before the thread started.

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In any case, nothing moved the OP: Buddhist doctrine includes a belief in rebirth. Whether one* believes in it is a different story.

[Adutiya]

Discussing rebirth on this platform is helpful to open up the issue, to share insights from the suttas, to shine light into blind spots and to point in the right direction. But isn’t Buddhism really about hearing the teachings of the Buddha and then giving space, attention, effort and time to realize for ourselves what he meant and what hinders us from discovering that?

May all who make it to the end of this thread follow the Noble Eightfold Path to see what needs to be seen, to do what needs to be done, to let go of what needs to be released, to know what needs to be known.

[stu]

I’ve got a little side observation to add before we close. I really dislike the wording “belief in rebirth”. I much prefer the wording “multiple life model” Vs “single life model”. One can adopt either model into their practice and each model will have different ramifications on how one lives. The Buddha of the EBTs seems to suggest taking up the “multiple life model” as part of practice. But of course, no one needs to take up all of the Buddha’s recommended practices all of the time.