Suttas in which arahants taught for others’ welfare

Discussion
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Ven. Bhikkhu Bodhi

Article says the following,

I’ll take the two stereotypes in order, and begin with the ancient arahants. Although the Buddha was the pioneer in discovering the path to liberation, this does not mean that his arahant disciples just selfishly reaped the benefits of the path and did nothing for others. To the contrary, in the suttas we can see that many of them became great teachers in their own right who were capable of guiding others towards liberation. The best known among them are Sāriputta, Mahākaccāna, Moggāllana, and Ānanda. There was the monk Puṇṇa who went to the barbarian Sunāparanta country, risking his life to teach the Dhamma to the people there. There were such nuns as Khemā and Dhammadinnā, who were outstanding preachers, Paṭācārā, who was a master of the discipline, and many others. For four hundred years, the Buddhist texts were preserved orally, transmitted from teachers to pupils, and obviously there had to be thousands of monks and nuns who dedicated their lives to learning the texts and teaching them to pupils, all for the purpose of preserving the good Dhamma and Vinaya in the world.

The example established by the Buddha’s great arahant disciples has been the model for the followers of the arahant ideal throughout history. While those who pursue this ideal do not make such lofty vows as do followers of the bodhisattva ideal, they are inspired by the example of the Buddha and his great disciples to work for the spiritual and moral uplift of others to the best of their ability: by teaching, by example, and by direct spiritual influence, inspired by the Buddha’s command to “wander forth for the welfare of the multitude, for the happiness of the multitude, out of compassion for the world, for the good, welfare, and happiness of devas and human beings.”

The life pattern of a follower of the arahant ideal conforms in many respects to that of the Buddha. I take as an example those who may not have actually achieved arahantship itself but are practicing within this framework and have reached some higher stage of spiritual accomplishment. In the early part of their lives, they may go to a forest monastery or to a meditation center to train under a competent teacher. Then, after reaching a sufficient level of maturity to practice on their own, they will go into solitude to develop their practice for a period that might last five years or longer. Then, at a certain point, their achievements will start to exert an influence on others. They might start to teach on their own initiative, or their teacher might ask them to begin teaching, or prospective students might realize they have achieved some superior state and request guidance from them. From this point on, they will begin to teach, and in time they might become well respected spiritual teachers, with many disciples and many centers under their guidance.

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/bodhi/arahantsbodhisattvas.html

I got this also in Bhikkhu Bodhi book, here an example of Sāriputta helping others reach the final goal.

https://suttacentral.net/an3.130/en/sujato

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All the suttas were taught by arahants for others welfare.

AN7.22:1.1: Evaṁ me sutaṁ—
AN7.22:1.1: So I have heard.

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I’m actually hoping to gather the suttas that they really say that they are going out for the welfare of the mass. Like I said there a sutta where as I remember Buddha was in seclusion and Sāriputta went to him to ask permission to go out to village to teach. But of course most suttas are by Arahant. :slight_smile:

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Hmm. This is tricky. For example, Ghaṭīkāra was a non-returner who dragged Jotipāla the student by the hair to see Kassapa Buddha.

MN81:9.1: Then Ghaṭīkāra grabbed Jotipāla by the hair of his freshly-washed head and said, ‘Dear Jotipāla, the Buddha Kassapa’s monastery is not far away.

But the sutta is taught by the Buddha (an arahant) who is expressing gratitude to Ghaṭīkāra for that teaching in a past life. So a non-returner’s teaching helped the Buddha himself on his journey and benefited all of us to this very day.

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Yes that is becoming my understanding because someone that is so far in Path has more conviction and is prone to lead others to the path. Like is said by Buddha doubt removed in Nava Sutta, as I mentioned above. But it doesn’t mean others can’t teach, that’s not what I’m looking for. I teach myself. It was recommended by Buddha. So the spiritual life is more complete. But celibate life is also the next step so the mind it’s not double sided.

More a sutta something like this. Like said by Maha Kassapa or a Arahant saying like Sāriputta did. Showing their intention.

“But seeing what benefit, Kassapa, have you long practiced these things?”

“Sir, seeing two benefits I have long practiced these things.

I see a happy life for myself in the present. And I have compassion for future generations, thinking: ‘Hopefully those who come after might follow my example.’ For they may think: ‘It seems that the awakened disciples of the Buddha for a long time lived in the wilderness, ate only alms-food, wore rag robes, and owned just three robes; and they praised these things. They were of few wishes, content, secluded, aloof, and energetic; and they praised these things.’ They’ll practice accordingly, which will be for their lasting welfare and happiness.

Seeing these two benefits I have long practiced these things.”

“Good, good, Kassapa! You’re acting for the welfare and happiness of the people, for the benefit, welfare, and happiness of gods and humans. So Kassapa, wear worn-out hempen rag robes, walk for alms, and stay in the wilderness.”

https://suttacentral.net/sn16.5/en/sujato

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There’s this passage in the Vinaya, in the first Khandhaka:

Kd.1.11.1 Then the Lord addressed the monks, saying: “I, monks, am freed from all snares, both those of devas and those of men. And you, 1.21 monks, are freed from all snares, both those of devas and those of men. Walk, monks, on tour for the blessing of the manyfolk, for the happiness of the manyfolk out of compassion for the world, for the welfare, the blessing, the happiness of devas and men. Let not two (of you) go by one (way.) Monks, teach dhamma which is lovely at the beginning, lovely in the middle, lovely at the ending. Explain with the spirit and the letter the Brahma-faring completely fulfilled, wholly pure. There are beings with little dust in their eyes, who, not hearing dhamma , are decaying, (but) if they are learners of dhamma , they will grow. And I, monks, will go along to Uruvelā, to the Camp township, in order to teach dhamma .”

Maybe this is what you mean?

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Ah. OK. For me the sutta that defines the heart and resolve of an arahant for the benefit of other’s welfare is the story of Ven. Puṇṇa who sought the Buddha’s blessing to teach in a foreign land:

MN145:5.30: “But if they do take your life with a sharp knife, what will you think of them then?”
MN145:5.31: “If they take my life with a sharp knife, I’ll think: ‘There are disciples of the Buddha who looked for someone to assist with slitting their wrists because they were horrified, repelled, and disgusted with the body and with life. And I have found this without looking!’That’s what I’ll think, Blessed One.That’s what I’ll think, Holy One.”
MN145:6.1: “Good, good Puṇṇa!

I like this sutta as an inspiration as well as a warning to those who consider arahanthood. The bar is set quite high.

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That is welcome also. Let’s say let’s gather all suttas of Buddha saying it and Arahant expressing that are going to do it. So meaning showing that the intention of Arahant doing it is part of their spiritual life. (Although sutta knowledge is needed to know who is a Arahant or not) so difficult

I think the easier guess is suttas related to Buddha’s last years. Most are Arahants

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Wonderful that’s my favorite also. One has to keep strong in loving kindness. That was a test to see if he was ready. Really nice.

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image

I think that’s why that sutta was made scholars believe. Sometimes a sutta is made to connect to a vinaya.

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I found this really good example also that shows the skills of social example by Buddha to Bhikkhus.

"And how is a monk one with a sense of time? There is the case where a monk knows the time: ‘This is the time for recitation; this, the time for questioning; this, the time for making an effort [in meditation]; this, the time for seclusion.’ If he didn’t know the time — ‘This is the time for recitation; this, the time for questioning; this, the time for making an effort; this, the time for seclusion’ — he wouldn’t be said to be one with a sense of time. So it’s because he does know the time — ‘This is the time for recitation; this, the time for questioning; this, the time for making an effort; this, the time for seclusion’ — that he is said to be one with a sense of time. This is one with a sense of Dhamma, a sense of meaning, a sense of himself, a sense of moderation, & a sense of time.

"And how is a monk one with a sense of social gatherings? There is the case where a monk knows his social gathering: ‘This is a social gathering of noble warriors; this, a social gathering of brahmans; this, a social gathering of householders; this, a social gathering of contemplatives; here one should approach them in this way, stand in this way, act in this way, sit in this way, speak in this way, stay silent in this way.’ If he didn’t know his social gathering — ‘This is a social gathering of noble warriors; this, a social gathering of brahmans; this, a social gathering of householders; this, a social gathering of contemplatives; here one should approach them in this way, stand in this way, act in this way, sit in this way, speak in this way, stay silent in this way’ — he wouldn’t be said to be one with a sense of social gatherings. So it’s because he does know his social gathering — ‘This is a social gathering of noble warriors; this, a social gathering of brahmans; this, a social gathering of householders; this, a social gathering of contemplatives; here one should approach them in this way, stand in this way, act in this way, sit in this way, speak in this way, stay silent in this way’ — that he is said to be one with a sense of social gatherings. This is one with a sense of Dhamma, a sense of meaning, a sense of himself, a sense of moderation, a sense of time, & a sense of social gatherings.

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an07/an07.064.than.html

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I would like to close off this post with a quote.

‘Don’t be an arahant, don’t be a bodhisattva, don’t be anything at all – if you are anything at all you will suffer’ [Ajahn Chah].

Thanks who everyone who helped. I think we have enough now.

Following users who share sutta please give link.

:pray:t4::pray:t4::pray:t4:

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Ok, but just one more:

From Majjhima Nikāya (MN31), The Shorter Discourse in Gosinga, in which 3 meditators informed the Buddha of their harmonious lifestyle and their attainments,

29The Blessed One said: “So it is, Dīgha, so it is! And if the clan from which those three clansmen went forth from the home life into homelessness should remember them with confident heart, that would lead to the welfare and happiness of that clan for a long time. And if the retinue of the clan from which those three clansmen went forth mn.i.211…the village from which they went forth…the town from which they went forth…the city from which they went forth…the country from which those three clansmen went forth from the home life into homelessness should remember them with confident heart, that would lead to the welfare and happiness of that country for a long time. If all nobles should remember those three clansmen with confident heart, that would lead to the welfare and happiness of the nobles for a long time. If all brahmins…all merchants…all workers should remember those three clansmen with confident heart, that would lead to the welfare and happiness of the workers for a long time.
If the world with its gods, its Māras, and its Brahmās, this generation with its recluses and brahmins, its princes and its people, should remember those three clansmen with confident heart, that would lead to the welfare and happiness of the world for a long time. See, Dīgha, how those three clansmen are practising for the welfare and happiness of the many, out of compassion for the world, for the good, welfare and happiness of gods and humans.”

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I was going to share but something told me someone is going to share it. But please mods keep the post open maybe eventually more users want to share what they found.

Thank you. :pray:t4: i meant I myself not sharing anymore. My last qoute was the cherry on the pie. Keep sharing. All the best