I just think that attaining Meditational Absorptions is long and steady personal and group work. Though it can be done quickly, it just isn’t honestly possible to give these Jhanas away unless more time is spent in learning and Realization. This is just my speculation, but I think that if these persons or people would silently learn and then teach Jhana to a few people over years and months, that would be beautifully wonderful and the Buddhist Way. But I think it’s just not realistic what the current model is.
Woah. They got coverage in Vox:
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While each jhāna seems to grow a little more difficult to describe than the last, even the first is not a mellow starting point. Descriptions range from “a laser beam of intense tingly pleasurable electricity,” similar to a sustained orgasm, to MDMA therapy without the drugs.
Ayy, next time I’m in Burning Man I be poppin’ 'em on dem JHĀNĀS MATE!
(/s)
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Please keep us advised of the next Burning Man date so we can join in 
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Then there’s capitalism. Ingram also worries about profit as a motive underlying advanced meditation research and technology. “This needs to be open source, open tech, open collaborative science for public benefit,” he said.
Aye, there’s the rub.
Wait, I already thought it was open source, open tech…
OK, how about this:
Let’s create the illusion that concentration meditation is new (but ancient), easily within reach of normal lay people in principle, but maddeningly out of reach unless you have the money to plop down at the feet of the Jhana Bros who have, for the first time ever – I mean, in the whole history of mankind – found a technology to deliver it to you!
Then they can become publicly philanthropic by revealing where on earth you might find additional (open source) data and thus demonstrate their commitment to the happiness of all sentient beings! They might even snag an interview with Vox – oh wait, they just did.
Anyway, once the corporate behemoth quietly waiting in the shadows is ready, it will buy the whole thing lock, stock, and barrel. That way, it can scale even more (like, into the gazillions of jhaners). White people in the global north who routinely ransack exotic-looking things for appropriation are especially to be thanked and praised for their imagination and creativity.
It’s a wonderful life!
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Wonderful indeed for the whole world to learn Jhānas.
I suppose no one ever pay royalties to the Buddha for the copyrights from utilising His original teachings and supreme meditation techniques 
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The article wasn’t that bad to be honest, it even questions whether the West should try to rip these practices out of context and comodify them, but it certainly seems to promote several misconceptions. For example, the author writes "The jhānas are like an optional training program, and the bliss stuff is just a side effect that contemplative traditions have urged practitioners not to get caught up in. " “Optional”…oh boy.
It also says , “Theravāda, the oldest branch of Buddhism”…yikes…
And also, no mention what the Buddha actually said, mostly what modern teachers say.
Anyways, just sharing to see what people think about this development. Maybe there will be a bunch of non-buddhists trying to do jhana soon.
We have been debating internally for 2500 years what “Jhana” is, isn’t time we came together and found out for once and all?
The best advice I’ve gotten internally from “secure” teachers, is to let jhana and whatnot come when they are ready, and concentrate on basics. I recently saw with my eyes the result of years of boring “faith” had constructed, which was hidden away from my keen mindful investigation. When the going got tough, and I almost was about to say, that’s it! There it came nice and smooth after I gave up my incessant prodding to have it my way.
It was one of those meditations, and not interesting, than confirming that basics are crucial when the mind expands beyond one’s expectations during deep meditation.
I believe Jhana if experienced before one is sufficiently stable, could mess it up more than expected. I also believe that if done correctly, one builds up an internal safety system that makes sure that the mind and the body never are served something it hasn’t got the strength for and the mental toolcase to go along. So, not to say anybody should be reckless, but know for oneself that there is this “safety control”
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This is already being discussed here in case you missed it:
Perhaps the @moderators would like to merge them?
Yes, I think the article itself is well-written for something in the mainstream press trying to cover such an esoteric topic. In effect, the Jhana Bros are telling us that this is not esoteric at all. But stripped of its historical, cultural and spiritual contexts, it becomes something else completely for the greedy corporations. I get angry that they take advantage of people who don’t know otherwise. Of course, anything can become a doorway, I suppose, even if it originates in greed and ignorance.
Still, I don’t like it. I don’t usually communicate so sardonically (referring to my post above ) – anyone who knows me personally would attest to that. But this just gets under my skin, as they say. And yet I am grateful to learn of it through this thread so that I know what’s out there.
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I haven’t listened to this, but it might be of interest to some here:
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Thank you Ven. @Snowbird. This is a great breakdown on Jhourney through the lens of a dedicated lay practitioner who also is a skilled communicator. My takeaways:
- V. Horn emphatically does not endorse Jhourney in its current form. He uses several ways to say that he strongly advises avoidance.
This is my first exposure to V. Horn … his style is quite understated so it says something that he tries to find so many different ways of not endorsing Jhourney. (They paid him as a consultant and now he says he is no longer their consultant.)
-
His primary concerns are that
(1) the Jhourney “teachers” are inexperienced relative to meditation retreat exposure in general (much less retreats focused on the jhānas), which exposes those who participate to increased risk of psychological harm;
(2) that Jhourney’s business model is basically practicing wholesale appropriation of various lineage teachings without permission (especially “Tranquil Wisdom Insight Meditation”, which I had never heard of);
(3) and that Jhourney’s founders are pushing full steam ahead anyway, neglecting to spend the necessary time and energy it would take to develop a fully tested “psycho-technology” for the masses. -
He says that, in principle, he could get on board with Jhourney if they “scaled deep before they scaled broad”; collaborated closely with lineage holders for permission to teach the jhānas (i.e., use the standard Buddhist method of gatekeeping the dhamma to some extent); and changed the name of what they’re doing – in effect, come up with their own terminology and stop selling it as “learning the jhānas.”
He went to some length throughout the podcast to emphasize the potential psychological harm for people who use Jhourney retreats as an entrée to meditation practice when, in fact, the people who are providing the retreats are not competent to do so.
Later addition to this post:
V. Horn endorsed “secularizing” jhāna meditation so long as it was done ethically and responsibly. In particular he advocates an academic/clinical setting with controlled variables for testing models. He has spoken personally with the linked principal investigator.
Thanks again for this link.
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Here’s a fantastic Dhamma talk by Ajahn Brahmali. In the talk he spends some time on the Jhana Bros and why what they’re selling isn’t Jhana.
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Thank you @Adutiya for flagging this 
. I appreciate Ajahn Brahmali’s straightforward approach. It’s refreshing because I feel like people really do have the capacity for the dhamma without all the props. We don’t have to keep watering everything down for fear that people won’t take refuge in these teachings otherwise.
One of my favorite lines from this talk: “I don’t understand why everyone doesn’t want to become a Buddhist!”
This is straight talk about what meditation is and isn’t as well as the requisite causes to support our jhana aspirations.
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A small book by Ayyā Khemā, Within our Own Heart, (BPS 518S, 2012), has been at my side for awhile now. I bought it for the last chapter, chapter the Meditative Absorbtsions, but the first chapter and 6th chapter on abandoning what needs to be abandoned that caught my attention. The book and its ideas are embedded in the Buddha Dhamma. It could not be more different than what you have described as…
… Leigh Brasington’s Seminar Jhaña Safaries!
I never met her or someone who did, so I am mystified. Had she seen him in this mode? Has he explained his change of views?
“The jhanas may be the single most important thing on the planet right now. You may think it’s superintelligence or longevity. That’s nothing without wellbeing.”
— Google DeepMind Strategic Advisor
In becoming familiar with a new group that I’d like to be part of the person who was interviewing me became animated and adamant that everybody had a right to their own form of Buddhism and there was no right or wrong.
There is a tendency in modern popular culture to not exclude anyone or pass judgment on something’s relative right or wrong, but that’s wrong. One must not confuse perceiving something as misguarded or right or wrong which is a real part of life on the one hand and with the oppressive effort of an oppressive Society to exclude a class of people or demonize the way they talk or think on the other.
I think my interviewer may have become intimidated by my talking about what the Theravada stood for or believed. was it because I was getting too close to something that may make precious membership go down? I genuinely do not know. But I know in my heart that group sales conditioned synthetic spirituality has to be seen as its own thing as distinct from a social movement of spirituality rooted in a culture or a seeker’s revelation.
I’ve never heard of these people (beyond this thread) and don’t know what they are doing to induce such states, or if the states are on par with what Buddhists call Jhanas or not, …. But my mind is immediately going to the potential after effects if they do come out of it with certain insights or certain capabilities.
What contingency plans are in place to help someone who, for example, might start seeing and hearing dead people, … are they going in knowing these beings are ‘out there’ and they might become aware of them …. or suddenly they can move in to oobe states …. do they know most of it is just BS from their own minds so they don’t freak out, … or that the drip of a tap might now become an overwhelming sensory experience, or they can’t switch their consciousness awareness off, or they comprehend the no-self business in a profound way that is a shock to the system if there was no prior notion of it, etc etc.
Are they told how to shut it down if it becomes prolific to the point of problematic? Is someone checking in with them after the event? Is there someone who can tap in and see if their experiences are legit or some sort of psychosis so they can be helped in the right manner?
On that note, are the Buddhists checking either what people know when they walk in to a retreat and aim for this stuff with potentially no back ground knowledge?
This can all be very irresponsible imo - leading people in to that - if not done right and by people with knowledge, experience and the capability of dealing with it backfiring on someone.
I had a man bought to me earlier this year who spent 3 months in a psych ward and was on the verge of being a catatonic basket case on the back of a retreat. ( I had nothing to do with this retreat btw … I just helped pick up the pieces) He nearly destroyed his life! Thank god, he is ok and thriving again … but there are very real potential dangers and not just anyone should be messing with this stuff or leading others in to it.
I can’t speak generally, but for myself, yes, most assuredly. I make sure that I speak personally with every person on the retreat, and that there is a mental health professional I can consult with if necessary.
Yes, it happens, and there is not nearly enough care for such people. Any mental health professional who has worked in this environment can tell you many such stories.
One thing I have learned is that retreats attract people with mental illness, either those who have been diagnosed and perhaps treated, or those who are not diagnosed. They are seeking solace for their mental health condition, which they may or may not confuse with spiritual advancement. Such folks are sometimes helped by a retreat, and sometimes not. But I think we need to be up front that a retreat is not a place to heal mental illness.
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Agree! I’ve been bouncing around the thought recently of doing a psychology degree to better help people who get in to such trouble. Combined with my ‘other skill set’ I could cover both angles ( spiritual and mental health) and hopefully be able to bring something multi-faceted to the table.
I’m glad to hear you are having convo’s with people and have resources available if need be.
I was recently at a workshop where 1/2 the participants admitted to issues … and were being taught trance by someone who I could tell ( from things she said) didn’t even know the difference between remote viewing and an obe. I doubt she would have known what to do if anything got too heavy duty.
I just hope the Jhana Bros have back up plans 