This world is mostly made of duality
Cakku and rūpa, ajjhattika and bāhira
But What is the origin the of subha dhātu?
I would like to ask the venerable monks or laypersons here who have good samatha and Vipassana this question.
SN14.11 might be of use to you
“Sir, due to what does each of these elements appear?”
…
The element of beauty appears due to the element of ugliness.
Yāyaṁ, bhikkhu, subhadhātu—ayaṁ dhātu asubhaṁ paṭicca paññāyati.
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Thank you bhante for replying,
I know sattadhātu sutta it’s not what I’m looking for because in this sutta the Buddha is talking about a dependcy or cause paṭicca which in this instance it has a major cause factor in mutuality cause aññamañña paccaya which will transform this topic into an abhidhammaic discussion which Tbh not what I’m looking for in this discussion.
I’m looking for the origin or the subha dhātu
(Samudaya) rather than paccaya.
The answer will not be found in only pariyatti way,
The answer would be more inclined towards paṭipatti and paṭivedha.
With much metta
In that case you would be better off posting to a practice forum. This forum is focused on the early Buddhist texts.
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Does Sn46.54 answer your question:
Subhaparamāhaṁ, bhikkhave, mettācetovimuttiṁ vadāmi, idhapaññassa bhikkhuno uttarivimuttiṁ appaṭivijjhato.
The beautiful is apex of heart’s release by goodwill/love, I say, for a mendicant who has not penetrated to a higher freedom.
You are using technical terms yet asking for a practical discussion.
Are you asking ‘how does the Buddha speak about cultivating the perception of the beautiful, and how can I do that in my practice?’ ?
A question phrased like this demonstrates more clearly your desired outcome and why you might ask such question in this forum.
Would you be willing to rephrase your original question in plain English explaining your desired outcome(s) and/or the scope of the discussion?
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It is precisely because I didn’t understand your question and why you were asking the question that I asked a counter-question.
There was absolutely no need for the above response. My enquiry was genuine and with the wish to assist you. It was also well within the scope of questioning which the Buddha suggested.
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“Sir, 4.1 how is each of these elements to be attained?”
“The 5.1 elements of light,beauty,the dimension of infinite space, the dimension of infinite consciousness, and the dimension of nothingness are attainments with perception.The element of the dimension of neither perception nor non-perception is an attainment with only a residue of conditioned phenomena.The element of the cessation of perception and feeling is an attainment of cessation.” SN14.12
Indeed, I have really a doubt about what you are really asking.
The term subhadhātu is found only in one sutta when using the search function SN14.11
Are you asking about the origin of subhadhātu as a mental element (dhamma)?
If so the origin (samudayā) is contact (phassa) according to Suttas.
That’s the answer to your question then - thou I am not sure you will be satisfied with it as we do not know if that is what you are asking.
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I’m still learning, but could it be that subha dhātu arises through contact, feeling, and perception—like in MN 18—and is shaped by how the mind proliferates around experience? It seems like SN 46.54 also treats it as a helpful perception in practice, but still something conditioned and ultimately let go of—does that sound right to others?
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Now that is a good start but it needs more analyzing.
So let’s analyze shall we.
Now what is subha dhātu?
It is the element of beauty, which has the characteristic of beauty,that which emits beauty. In other words it is 4 of the 8 worldly conditions(lābha,yasa,pasaṁsā,sukha)
It could be manifested either mentally or physically.
Now what is the origin of the 4 of the 8 worldly conditions.
The answer is sankarakhanda if we talk more precisely cetanā.
Now what is cetanā?
Cetanā is volition, will, intention, impulse to act. Either skillful or unskillful.
It is one of the major parts or support in creating the the next nāma-rūpa moment or in short creating a world for viññana or consciousness to establish itself in and hold itself in.
This is proofed in SN 12.38 cetanā sutta.
Now how the process of cetanā works
When (eye,ear,nose,tongue,body,mind)
Meets it’s counterpart in (form,sound,smell,touch,dhamma)
There is phasso then Vedanā feeling is born, now at that moment, because there is still underlying tendencies of of akusala Mula or unskillful roots.meaning the wisdom faculty is still not developed We either keep holding on, or push away, or not care about the process.
If it’s pleasureable we hold on and wants more, if it’s suffering we push away wants something else it’s opposite, if it’s neutral we just don’t care and let the process play without anything to notice which let the samsaric process that is dependent origination keep flowing in a cyclical manner.
Why is that now let’s see what the Buddha said SN 35.146.
Cakkhu, bhikkhave, purāṇakammaṁ abhisaṅkhataṁ abhisañcetayitaṁ vedaniyaṁ daṭṭhabbaṁ.
The eye is old deeds. It should be seen as produced by choices and intentions, as something to be felt.
Now whatever that eye sees either beautiful or ugly has its base it’s origin in cetanā.
If it’s beautiful then it has the characteristic of beauty which emits beauty as I mentioned Before.
Hope this helps everyone here.
now we should remember one thing studying alone will not work it’s takes studying and practicing and realizing To understand reality.
If we think the dhamma is only in books then we are philosophers and scholars Rather than Practitioners of Buddhism aiming for the deathless state.
If some individuals took the previous admonishment as personal they should refocus and practice.
In MN 24 ven punna said
In the same way, reverend, purification of ethics is only for the sake of purification of mind. Purification of mind is only for the sake of purification of view. Purification of view is only for the sake of purification by traversing doubt. Purification by traversing doubt is only for the sake of purification of knowledge and vision of what is the path and what is not the path. Purification of knowledge and vision of what is the path and what is not the path is only for the sake of purification of knowledge and vision of the practice. Purification of knowledge and vision of the practice is only for the sake of purification of knowledge and vision. Purification of knowledge and vision is only for the sake of extinguishment by not grasping. The spiritual life is lived under the Buddha for the sake of extinguishment by not grasping.”
You always should remember, Your ability to explain something is a measure of how much you understand it.
With much metta to everyone here.