SuttaCentral

Therapadana of Khuddaka https://suttacentral.net/tha-ap1/en/walters

Dear Ajahn,

Regarding doctrine of " It’s impossible of arising two Buddhas at the same time at the same solar system" (Aṅguttara Nikāya 1.277 and Digha Nikaya 28), which is I believe as authentic, someone had present me the Therapadana which interpreted as contrary to that doctrine.

Here’s some text of verse in Therapadana:

Those Buddhas who live here-and-now,
who have no rivals in the world,
and those who lived in former times:
I brought them all into the world.

Lonely Buddhas, many hundreds,
Self-dependent, Unconquered Ones,
and those who lived in former times:
I brought them all into the world.

There are many wishing-trees there
who are both human and divine.
Having arranged all of the cloth
I give them each the triple robe.

Filling lovely bowls made of gems
I then provided alms to them:
foods that were soft, and hard foods too,
well-prepared food and drink to taste.

Being given burnished-cloth robes
which were just like divine garments,
honey and crystallized sugar,
sesame oil and sugar-cane juice,
with milk-rice, each one satisfied,
they formed an exalted circle.

Having entered a jeweled room
like a lion its secret cave,
they got onto priceless couches
in the sleeping-lion posture.

Mindfully rising up they then
sat cross-legged on those couches,
filled with delight in altered states,
the pasturage of all Buddhas.

Some are preaching their doctrines then,
while others sport in miracles.
Others apply special knowledges,
masters of special knowledges.
Various lakhs of others still
transform into various shapes.

Buddhas are questioning Buddhas
about the range of omniscience.
Understanding deep, abstruse points,
they achieve their Awakenings.

Followers questioning Buddhas;
Buddhas questioning followers.
Questioning one another they
then provide each other answers.

Buddhas and Lonely Buddhas too,
followers and the attendants,
thus delighting in devotions,
are really enjoying the palace.

Could you please give answer to this contradiction? It become an argument of which Sutta is true. Thanks,

Namo Buddhaya :pray:

  1. The apadana literature is quite late and also quite mythologically embellished. I wouldn’t regard it as the literal word of the historic Buddha. This text is obviously a visualization practice, not a history book :joy: Doesn’t make it unimportant, it’s just a different kind of text.

  2. More to the point, you ignored the critical “…in the same world system” from the AN/DN quote! The apadana here is saying that (with his psychic powers) the Bodhisattva summoned those Buddhas from other world systems — and even called up some from the past too for good measure!

Hope that helps! :grinning_face_with_smiling_eyes:

Since this Therapadana is in contradiction to the Major Suttas, why is it still include in SuttaCentral.net? What is SuttaCentral.net 's policy about Authenticity and Consistency of contents of Suttas doctrines?
Please advise. Thanks

Per point 2 above, it is not in contradiction.

As to its inclusion in SuttaCentral: While the focus of SuttaCentral is on the Early Texts, I believe the entire Pāli Canon is hosted out of respect for the tradition and for the sake of completeness.

As for advice: I guess I advise honesty and metta. They’ve served me well the last few years :slight_smile: You’re welcome!

This apadana also on contradiction to SN 44.1 and 44.3 which explain Buddha doesn’t make declaration regarding existence after death:

King Pasenadi of Kosala went up to the nun Khemā, bowed, sat down to one side, and said to her:

“Ma’am, does a Realized One exist after death?”

“Great king, this has not been declared by the Buddha.”

“Well then, does a Realized One not exist after death?”

“This too has not been declared by the Buddha.”

“Well then, does a Realized One both exist and not exist after death?”

“This has not been declared by the Buddha.”

“Well then, does a Realized One neither exist nor not exist after death?”

“This too has not been declared by the Buddha.”

Based on these Suttas (DN, AN and SN), this apadana should be considered as Fake Sutta as others Sutras which is not included in SuttaCentral.net such as amitabha, sadharmapundarika, vimalakirti, heart sutra/prajnaparamita, etc; All those sutras are in Contradiction to many Suttas.
To preserve Authenticity and Consistency of Buddhism, and accord to AN 1.140 and AN 1.150,
I’d recommended to not included this apadana to the SuttaCentral.net site. Thanks,

Namo Buddhaya :pray:

To which Apadāna verse are you referring?

This is a link to the entire first chapter. Can you quote the verse that makes a declaration about the existence [of an arahant presumably?] after death?


Those Buddhas who live here-and-now,
who have no rivals in the world,
and those who lived in former times:
I brought them all into the world.

Lonely Buddhas, many hundreds,
Self-dependent, Unconquered Ones,
and those who lived in former times:
I brought them all into the world.

There are many wishing-trees there
who are both human and divine.
Having arranged all of the cloth
I give them each the triple robe.

Filling lovely bowls made of gems
I then provided alms to them:
foods that were soft, and hard foods too,
well-prepared food and drink to taste.

Being given burnished-cloth robes
which were just like divine garments,
honey and crystallized sugar,
sesame oil and sugar-cane juice,
with milk-rice, each one satisfied,
they formed an exalted circle.

Having entered a jeweled room
like a lion its secret cave,
they got onto priceless couches
in the sleeping-lion posture.

Mindfully rising up they then
sat cross-legged on those couches,
filled with delight in altered states,
the pasturage of all Buddhas.

Some are preaching their doctrines then,
while others sport in miracles.
Others apply special knowledges,
masters of special knowledges.
Various lakhs of others still
transform into various shapes.

Buddhas are questioning Buddhas
about the range of omniscience.
Understanding deep, abstruse points,
they achieve their Awakenings.

Followers questioning Buddhas;
Buddhas questioning followers.
Questioning one another they
then provide each other answers.

Buddhas and Lonely Buddhas too,
followers and the attendants,
thus delighting in devotions,
are really enjoying the palace.

It’s interpreted as “brought the past Arahant in to the world”. Since past Arahant should be dead already long time ago, how could one brought them back? Are they still exist after death?