Is anyone have been watching his thoughts and see where the paticcasamuppada come from?
Seeing it can sometime be a bit disturbing, but it allow to understand why some thoughs come from.
I wonder if it’s a practice i should follow or just let the thoughts go?
What is the relation of thoughts arising and paticcasamuppada in your understanding?
Why is it important to understand why specific thoughts arise or where they come from?
Why would you not let thoughts go?
Also, this post looks like it fits better in another category, I think, like Discussion. Also, by the rules one should not discuss personal practice, so best to rephrase your question to be more general.
Vipassana practice of tracing cause and effect is best done with samatha as a basis to have stability of mind and strength of mind to be able to handle whatever arises.
Go back to samatha, build up one’s strength, then one can do vipassana better.
I mean exactly this, in my own experience thoughts arising come in part du to paticcasamuppada.
Take a single man, with wrong livehood, on a friday night he goes meet some friends at the bar.
Fews hours pass, and drinks come and go, later he go to his home, tired and drunk.
After only fews hours sleep. he woke up, his head remembering the number of drinks he took.
In the evening, after a day of laziness, he meets some of his friends, a nice dinner is organize as it is every weekend, after eating the appetizer, the main dishes is bring to the table.
What a nice piece of red beef, he thinks.
The host is French and say, what best to have with that beautiful piece of meet than a nice bottle of red wine? His friend begin to fill the glass of the ladies, after fews glass filled, come his turn.
The body is still in pain du to the excess of the last night, a feeling come from his stomach, he remember the first hours of his day and then decline respectfully.
Paticcasamuppada. Small short thoughts arise out of the darkness of ignorance; out of impulses (asava) generated by past actions. Large long thoughts arise from when craving occurs from sense contact.
If you want to go on a deep dive into the nature of thoughts, what they are, how and why they arise and how to begin looking behind the curtain to break your enchantment with them, here is a Rains Retreat talk by Ajahn Brahm that addresses exactly what you’re inquiring about.
He discusses how to investigate how thoughts are based in a sense of self and why and how they hinder our path all the way to awakening, even in the highest meditative realms of the mind. Understanding the ramifications of why and how thoughts arise is crucial to being able to begin to experience dependent arising in real time and to learn how to be better equipped to let thoughts go.
This talk gets better and better as it goes on, so listen to the end and you’ll get perspectives that you may have never considered.
Thank you for this link. It’s so nice sometimes. You find a link on a forum that you didn’t know you needed right at this moment. You have a nagging knowledge that you need something, but not quite sure what it is…then…
I think we can only go back so far with tracing our thoughts and what caused thoughts. The Buddha stated that there is an undiscoverable first cause. So if the Buddha can’t trace the beginning then I see no point in trying unless one wants to go mad.
The good news is: there is the end of thoughts, there is a temporary cessation of thoughts during meditation, and the default mode network will quiet down. So I think one should pay attention to what causes one’s thoughts to quiet down rather than pay attention to what caused thoughts in the first place.
Sometimes, thought thinks itself. However, one has the power and intention of renunciation especially in thought. It is a lesson in humility and acceptance of our own limitations.
In response to Professor Robert Wright regarding thoughts, Bhante Bodhi said: “We take these thoughts to be identified with us, while the Buddha stated that thoughts that arise are just conditioned phenomena. We latch onto thoughts and thoughts latch onto one another, creating a sense of solidity. Thus, creating a sense of connection of our identity with our thoughts."
In short, you can’t think your way out of suffering.
Thank you for adding that clarification, Sumana! Getting stuck following thoughts back to their origin would just be adding to the problem!
I don’t think that trying to find the origin of thoughts was the intent of what Ajahn Brahm was saying. I think his point was to cultivate awareness of thoughts in order to know that they are conditioned so that the enchantment of self can be diminished. Once one sees in real time that thought after thought is conditioned, it doesn’t matter what the thought is, what it’s about or where it came from. It’s important tosimply see and understand how the self-perpetuating nature of most thoughts reinforce the illusion of self. With some vigilance of awareness, it can chip away at that sense of self on a personal level.
As a side observation, at first glance your question felt like fishing for verbiage that could feed something else.
Then, when I went to the PaliCanon app you advertise in your profile, I noticed that you give people an AI option. Once that option is exercised, the app AI imports Bhante Sujato’s translations.
It’s good that you’re contemplating about this. Since you’re participating in this forum, this is a gentle reminder that Bhante Sujato and the Teams here are committed to 100% AI-free.
If you have time, Bhante Sujato’s series of essays here can explain very clearly his stance on AI.