Where did Mara come from?

Y’all might be interested in “Malleable Mara” - an academic book tracing the history of the myth.

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Fascinating!
Any idea if these stories are from the EBTs or the commentaries?
Many attained Thai masters suggest that Mara is both external and a personification of inner psychological states. And we need to be vigilant of both. This seemingly is also borne out in the texts.
Interesting that Mara is a resident of one of the highest deva realms…makes one wonder how it was possible for someone to be born in that high realm and still have so much delusion? It would suggest that the “Mara-to-be” would have attained a high jhana but not have much wisdom.

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Great question Vic. I’ll try to ask Ajahn Punnadhammo about this after one of his online dhamma talks. :slight_smile: I’m wondering what he will say and if he do, I’ll post his reply here.

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I found this to be a great resource on Mara: https://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/guruge/wheel419.pdf

His answer to your question, in short, is that the Pali canon has both poetry and prose in different places, and the fact that Mara usually appears in poetry means that he is simply a poetic device.

Hmm, I wonder about that…Mara does appear in some major Suttas within the EBT. I can imagine that his backstory may have been embellished later in poetry but it appears that Mara as an “entity” is likely from the earliest strata of EBT.

The article explains it better than I can.

Hi Vic! :slight_smile:

As promised I’ve asked Ajahn Punnadhammo your question regarding Mara and delusion.

48:12 in this video. :slight_smile:

With Metta :yellow_heart:

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Ajahn Punnadhammo said in his cosmology talks with Ajahn Sona, Mara is an office of power, a honorric title, like King or sth.

Thanks, @Invo. That was very interesting. I understand what he said about the attainment of Mara that although requiring spiritual development could still be amenable to corruption. It’s basically the lack of right view. One can “progress” quite far spiritually and still lack right view–the practice of high states of samadhi attained by the Buddha’s teachers may be an appropriate example.

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Mara is not a title or a role! A mara is in complete slander and rebellion against the Dhamma!

I remember the mara entering the belly of his disciple. It seems then that it might have been used for beings that enter humans. Those can bring influence to a ordinary person. We see that Sangha also believed Mara can travel until other realms. Similar to Bible. Where the devil talks to “God” on how to treat Job. I have read that in India they used stories alot to teach, so maybe using a name that all knew, was similar to everyone knowing characters in Netflix series.