Why there is Buddhānusmṛti and not of all Ancient Buddhas

Discussion
21

I’m talking of a inscriptions. He said he visited that Buddha stupa. The art that there is of the ancient Buddhas at Sanchi stupa was made way after King Asoka

That’s my point it was also title like Buddha. It just means they are worthy. But in early inscriptions Arahant as title is not found.
:man_shrugging:

Lifestyle. Meaning like a hermit. He said it. I don’t want to assume like I know. But if eliminate the words Arahants, Buddhas and just use Sage or Seer. Someone is called that when living in forest alone dedecited to finding liberation, deathless. So I’m not saying that he was a private Buddha and Full Buddha as you think maybe. But that there could be that everyone seeking Awakening doesn’t know if he will be the chosen Awakened One to make a sasana. That’s why they start as normal hermit. For example when Buddha awakened he went to teach. Before that his career was hermit. After when he started getting the two main disciples and established a sasana then he is considered a full Buddha. But again I know there is no way to understand. So don’t bother.

I’m sorry not fluent in English as you. You I really don’t know. I’m just keep studying like you. You seem educated. :+1:

Internet is slow. I lost many things I wrote to you. :man_facepalming:t3:

Just read this. In that study says about the inscriptions that Arahant seems not a early used word. And other interesting inscriptions.

An Old Inscription from AmaravatI and the Cult of the Local Monastic Dead in Indian Buddhist Monasteries

https://journals.ub.uni-heidelberg.de/index.php/jiabs/article/download/8787/2694/

My study is influenced by history books and inscriptions etc. that’s how I make my “assumptions”

We have lost a lot of understanding of the tradition of Buddhism.

Maybe it’s been also about being lucky to be born in the middle country of India while there is Buddha, for you to attain Sainthood. Actually right now there must be Hermit Buddhas in India and Himalayas etc. the persons that Can get awakened now. Has to be the ones that go forth by themselves. Naturally. Like Maha Kassapa did.

About the middle country or city teaching you find mentioned a lot. But I’m just saying. I know it’s off-topic

I was born in the city of the thirty.

Probably means the middle of India, where is the home of the gods.

SuttaCentral

There is another sutta that I can’t find now. That Buddha itself say being born in the city. Meaning middle country of India when a Buddha was born is the best moment to practice. I can’t find it now. :man_shrugging:

22

There is unparralel sutta found also in Ghandhara. I think not being able to Attain liberation, it was normal that hermit Buddha was something to aspire for the future.

[The monk] said, “The true Dharma has disappeared.” Zadamitra said, “If the true Dharma shall have disappeared, then I will attain solitary enlightenment.”

So the belief that if attainment is not possible. Hermit Buddha is the Path.

Author says

This story is also of interest with regard to the history of Buddhism in Gandhāra. The hero’s name, Zadamitra, is an Indianized version of an originally Iranian name, which would probably have been pronounced Zādmihr in his native language. His non-Indian name suggests that Zadamitra belonged to the ruling elite of Saka conquerors in the first century CE, many of whom became generous patrons of the Buddhist monastic communities. It is therefore not surprising that he is shown in a favorable light as an enthusiastic follower of the Dharma who makes a vow to attain enlightenment in a future life. This calls to mind the similar theme of the story in which an unnamed Saka man speaks about the future disappearance of the Dharma in translation 6f. The composer of this text, presumably a Buddhist monk, was evidently favorably inclined toward the Saka patrons of Gandhāran Buddhism in the first century CE and was no doubt also concerned to encourage them to continue their patronage.

23

“Early” inscriptions are not early - those are from a like 100-200(?) or so years after the Buddha’s demise.

So I am not sure if it can be used as compelling evidence regarding the origin of Buddhism, I don’t think.

No problem at all.
Yes, I am still trying to learn Dhamma-Vinaya. I am glad that you seem to be trying too. :slightly_smiling_face:
Would you be interested in the private messaging, especially regarding learning Dhamma-Vinaya?

24

I don’t remember the years but the study was explaining all over the stupas the earliest don’t seem to use Arahant. Your right that we can’t use that. But it does give a chronology of Buddhism. For example how we know now with all this fast technology what is early or later Buddhism just by reading. The early stupas mostly rebuildings. So the Date of inscriptions are usually not easy. But did you read it good? Because it seems Sthavira language

Anytime.

25

The Edicts of Ashoka are a collection of more than thirty inscriptions on the pillars, as well as boulders and cave walls, attributed to Emperor Ashoka of the Mauryan Empire who reigned from 268 BCE to 232 BCE.

This seems to be the rough time period of the inscriptions.

I am not saying those are not important, nor that they can’t be used for some purpose.
I just think that information is more relevant to claims made about a period a little bit after the Buddha - not necessarily during the Buddha’s time or pre-Buddha.

26

No the study is obviously showing Some inscriptions older than King Asoka because the name Bhagavato Budhasa is used. Which was also used in very early inscription of Buddha relic. So I see that. Because there is no Arahant title for Buddha. The stupas are new but the inscriptions sometimes are earlier. The common names for Buddha then was different.

The true tradition then is seen that way.

Even nikayas is mentioned

image

But back to topic. The reality it wasn’t about names. It was about Awakening which is beyond names. :pray:t4: Hermit Buddha or not. One taste Awakening.

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27

It’s very interesting that King Asoka inscription mention only the name of one previous Buddha. He visited Gotama Buddha birth place also.

image

256 B.C.—Double enlargement of the Stupa of Buddha Konakamana.
250 B.C.—Pilgrimage to Lumbini Garden, the birthplace of the Buddha ; visit to the Stupa of Buddha Konakama

I find it strange he never mentioned the others. But of course it doesn’t matter. Faith that there was past Sages who was Awakened is the importance

28

Have you read this whole book?

Based on the sources that you have been looking into, I think that you might find it very, very interesting.

Will do soon.

29

I didn’t fully yet. But the little I did going threw it. It’s very good.

Interesting thing said by the above pdf book regarding King Asoka

Even with regard to the stupa, the history of that type of structure does not begin with Asoka. For instance, he " enlarged to twice its size the stupa of Buddha Konakamana," as stated in the Nigliva Pillar inscription, which shows that the construction of the original stupa was not due to Asoka.

That’s seems to have been a indication of two things. The tradition of Stupas was older for these Buddhas to be improved by Kings. Even that the tradition of Buddhas was a normal tradition in India society

30

For example here we have a 150 years after Buddha inscription, that say only Budhassa Bhagavato. Same as the other inscriptions in the pdf. And the stupa location is interesting also. Very close to Buddha birth place. I imagine that was the center of Sakya clan. :slight_smile:

See at 20:06

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Please let me know if and when you finish it. I would be happy to discuss it with you!

Thank you for sharing.

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32

I stopped when I gave me headache because it was too high deep study. I think the lack of understanding all words. I will try again when I have time. Will make notes. Will let you know.

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33

No problem. Please feel free to ask me questions, I can try to help as suitably as I can.

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34

Here I found the description of the Chinese pilgrims. The best description was this one. All King Asoka marked with pillars for the Buddha Kanakamuni and the one before it.

That name again. Muni is typically hermits name.

image
image640×646 156 KB

http://himalaya.socanth.cam.ac.uk/collections/journals/bot/pdf/bot_1989_03_03.pdf.

Suprisely nothing is really mentioned of Buddha Kassapa. But the years of their visit is not mentioned. This last person gives the best description. The others just mentioned Ancient Buddhas. Since their year of visit is not mentioned. They could be Bodhisattvas also. They all probably visited late.

(The last Buddhas are said to have established vinayas. The 3 eldest ones didn’t establish vinaya. Jatakas and commentaries say Hermit Buddhas teach. But don’t establish a order. Seems again that’s those 3 was very close to hermit description)

35

We live in a world where you have to search yourself for the truth.

The Sage of Vedeha, his body bent, asked
the Thus-Gone-One dwelling in Jetavana,
“Indeed there are those called the Lonely Buddhas;
through what causes do they become so, Wise One?”

Then spoke the Omniscient, Outstanding, Great Sage,
to lucky Ānanda with his honeyed voice,
“Who performed service among former Buddhas,
but didn’t get freed in their dispensations

If that is the tradition than we should expect they practiced for future Solitary Enlightenment. Then it’s obvious that the tradition went from Arahanthood to Buddhahood. While the last disciples of Buddha was living that’s when actually the chance is to get Arahantship was probably over. :scream: if you don’t achieve that during a Buddha time then in the future you will become Solitary Buddha. That could have been also after Buddha died obviously. Then Petakopadesa should be trusted as more early tradition. Because it has this same tradition which is not available anymore in nikayas. So that’s why I believed Solitary Buddha then evolved to full Buddhahood. Or better said the Bodhisattva path that we find mentioned in very early Mahayana text was probably a Solitary Buddha tradition but after the tradition was forgotten and the new tradition probably thought it was about Full Buddhahood.

https://suttacentral.net/tha-ap2/en/walters

@SeriousFun136

36

Where is the evidence for this claim? It seems speculative.

I don’t know if/think that this is necessarily the case.
What if someone does not wish to become a solitary Buddha?

37

I remember seeing that in a text somewhere in the past. It stuck in my memory because it said they all launched into the sky and exploded like fireworks when they decided to enter Nirvana to make room for the Buddha in the world. I can’t remember what text it was though, maybe when I was studying the Abhiniskramana (?), which is a Chinese text like the Mahavastu.

39

It’s in the pdf I shared on top. It’s in Agamas. :joy: obviously. You study that.

40

Don’t you see it yet? Oh no. Your in the matrix maybe. Unplug. :electric_plug: :joy: just joking.

You have to understand what I just shared. It’s seems Petakodesa and it has same tradition as Solitary Buddha is something for the future. The last possible achievable if you didn’t achieve Arahantship. Buddha suttas remember is not talking to us. It’s oral tradition from Buddha time. So of course right now we have actually no possible way to know which is the Path that is available to us. But evidently for long time it doesn’t seem there is Arahantship. Reality check. We have really advanced Bhikkhus in the past but very few. We have no way to confirm their Arahantship. But I still have faith. But there is something we don’t understand. Let’s dig deeper.

But what you asked. My assumption is based on was said.

If liberation doesn’t happen while serving a Buddhas. That means everyone that didn’t ever make it for Arahantship. It’s the ones who will be solitary Buddha.

What do we know if we served Buddhas in past? Don’t you get it? We where born after Buddha. If we are still on earth. Still in samsara. 2500 years after Buddha. That means we been long in samsara to have once served a Buddha. That means them Solitary Buddhahood is open for those of us that didn’t actually hear the Teaching of a Buddha.

This means there might be Solitary Buddhas out there and we don’t know. It’s all about luck. Like I said before. Luck to be born in time there is a Buddha. Obviously what we can do is prepare right now because we heard the teaching. But we should try our best for higher attainments.

:pray:t4: