AN 9.36 has perfect parallel in Sarvāstivāda Abhidharma, dharma-skandha-pāda-śāstra 阿毘達磨法薀足論

4​:crown::wheel_of_dharma::classical_building:Sarv Ab Dk dharma-skandha-pāda-śāstra

Sarv Ab Dk 15.6 - Undistractible-lucidity 6🌄 and realizing nirvana within jhāna ∥AN 9.36

It’s a very imperfect google translation from chinese + english,

but I’ve asked Dr. William Chu to check the Chinese source against AN 9.36,

and so far he’s confirmed it matches these important points from AN 9.36:

  • 4 jhānas + 3 formless attainments (7 perception attainments) are not states of frozen stupor. Like AN 9.36, you do vipassana WHILE you’re in that jhāna, even realizing nirvana.

  • The 8th and 9th formless attainments, one can not do vipassana while in that attainment, one has to emerge before doing so.

  • Both suttas have the archer similes
    =====================================
    Suttacentral doesn’t have any agama parallels listed for AN 9.36, is there a reason why dharma-skandha-pāda-śāstra aren’t considered as parallel?

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Congratulations, you’ve discovered a parallel. It’s not on SuttaCentral because no one is looking at Chinese Abhidharma texts and documenting parallels with Pali suttas and/or no one is updating SuttaCentral’s parallels data. There are lots and lots of parallels to be found and documented yet. Which is why I have repeatedly pointed out to people that just because there’s no parallel listed doesn’t mean there’s no parallel that exists.

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@lucid24-frankk @cdpatton in AN 9.36 it is not completely obvious that the text is attributed to the Buddha speaking. Is it attributed to the Buddha in the parallel or is it also ambiguous?

Hmm, from this it does seem that it is the Teacher speaking:

Why is it the concentration of the enlightenment factor?
He said to the World-Honored One:

:pray:

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The google translation that he has on his website to woeful and should not be published publicly. It is a sutra quote in the original and a parallel.

I look forward to your upcoming translation @cdpatton if you are planning to accomplish it. Just in case you are not…

  1. I respectfully ask for your compassion, will you please translate this sutta to aid sentient beings away from suffering?
  2. I respectfully ask for your compassion, will you please translate this sutta to aid sentient beings away from suffering?
  3. I respectfully ask for your compassion, will you please translate this sutta to aid sentient beings away from suffering?

:pray:

Good sir, how is this for a translation?

How is the “Factor of Enlightenment” Established?

The Blessed One said:

Bhikshus, you should know that I have stated that by relying on the first jhāna, one can eliminate all impurities. Similarly, I have said that by relying on the second, third, and fourth jhānas, the realm of infinite space, the realm of infinite consciousness, and the realm of nothingness, one can eliminate all impurities.

Bhikshus, you should know why I have made such a statement. It is because there are bhikshus who, through such practices, detach from desire and unwholesome states, experiencing initial and sustained thought, and attain joy and pleasure born of seclusion, thus dwelling in the first jhāna.

These bhikshus do not reflect on such practices but instead contemplate the forms, feelings, perceptions, volitions, and consciousness they have attained, seeing these phenomena as akin to a disease, a boil, an arrow causing affliction, and as impermanent, suffering, empty, and not-self.

With profound revulsion, fear, and restraint toward these phenomena, they then gather their mind and place it in the realm of the deathless (nirvana). Reflecting on this realm as peaceful and sublime, they abandon all dependencies, completely detach from defilements, and attain final extinction in nirvana.

Just like a skilled archer or his student, who first practices shooting at close-range targets made of clay or straw, can eventually shoot and break distant, hard targets as well.

Bhikshus, likewise, by such practices, one detaches from desire and unwholesome states, experiencing initial and sustained thought, and attains joy and pleasure born of seclusion, thus dwelling in the first jhāna.

These bhikshus do not reflect on such practices but instead contemplate the forms, feelings, perceptions, volitions, and consciousness they have attained, seeing these phenomena as akin to a disease, a boil, an arrow causing affliction, and as impermanent, suffering, empty, and not-self.

With profound revulsion, fear, and restraint toward these phenomena, they then gather their mind and place it in the realm of the deathless (nirvana). Reflecting on this realm as peaceful and sublime, they abandon all dependencies, completely detach from defilements, and attain final extinction in nirvana.

By knowing and seeing in this way, they are liberated from the taint of sensual desire, from the taint of becoming, and from the taint of ignorance. Having been liberated, they know directly: “I have finished birth, the holy life has been fulfilled, what had to be done has been done, there is no further existence for me.”

It is for this reason that I say that by relying on the first jhāna, one can eliminate all impurities. Just as I have said that by relying on the first jhāna, one can eliminate all impurities, I have also said that by relying on the second, third, and fourth jhānas, the realm of infinite space, the realm of infinite consciousness, and the realm of nothingness, one can eliminate all impurities.

In the same way, one should also say this about the second jhāna: There are bhikshus who, through such practices, quieting initial and sustained thought, with internal clarity and unification of mind, without initial and sustained thought, attain joy and pleasure born of concentration, thus dwelling in the second jhāna.

These bhikshus do not reflect on such practices but contemplate the forms, feelings, perceptions, volitions, and consciousness they have attained, seeing these phenomena as impermanent, suffering, empty, and not-self.

The same applies to the realm of nothingness: There are bhikshus who, through such practices, transcend the realm of infinite consciousness, and enter and dwell in the realm of nothingness.

They do not reflect on such practices but contemplate the feelings, perceptions, volitions, and consciousness they have attained, seeing these phenomena as impermanent, suffering, empty, and not-self.

Bhikshus, you should know that even in states of concentration, such practices should be carried out. There are also the realm of neither perception nor non-perception and the cessation of perception and feeling. I have said that those bhikshus who practice these states should frequently enter and exit them.

By practicing these seven supporting concentrations, the mind associated with the intention of eliminating impurities, being unified and stabilized, is called concentration. It is also called the root of concentration, the power of concentration, the factor of enlightenment of concentration, and right concentration. It is the holy, supramundane, impurity-free path that leads to the end of suffering and to the ultimate cessation of suffering.

Those who are learners, according to what they have seen in their practices, reflect and contemplate to reach the ultimate conclusion. They see deeply the faults in all formations and the virtues of final nirvana.

For the arahants, who have liberated their minds, by reflecting and contemplating to reach the ultimate conclusion, the mind associated with the intention of eliminating impurities, being unified and stabilized, is called the factor of enlightenment of concentration.

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It’s better, but it drops out some words and phrases, doesn’t handle the abbreviations properly, and uses “standard” translations of some terms that aren’t actually that accurate. A couple things, like translating “eternal Nirvana” as “final Nirvana” is just downright misleading. [Edit: Not to mention the title. The passage begins: “What is the awakening factor of concentration (samadhi)?” It’s an excerpt from the commentary on all seven factors.]

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Alright, I was testing (things) as you might’ve noticed. Thanks a lot for the feedback !

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I’d be happy to add the parallel and by the looks of it there are more parallels there too. But I would need the Taisho number and CBETA file number to do so. It would be good to add the original text to SC too. Right now it is not there:

https://suttacentral.net/lzh-dk?view=normal&lang=en

I’ll be happy to do all this after the vassa.

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Hi. Where does the idea come from that vipassana is not occurring in jhana? I have never read this in any sutta. Obviously all things are not-self and all conditioned things lack inherent pleasurableness therefore these must also be inherent characteristics of any jhana.

However, if it is believed Mahasi verbal noting or Mahayana analytical thinking is “vipassana” it could occur the idea those such as Ajahn Brahm teaching true jhana are not including vipassana. I read “vipassana” means “clear seeing”. Obviously, there is no “thinking” occurring in jhana; even though direct “perception” of reality would occur in jhana.

Hi. If Arahant was being attained in the 1st jhana or other jhana, why has this text made a distinction between “learners” and “arahants”?

Hi. If the path was “impurity-free”, why would it lead to the end of suffering rather than already in itself be the end of suffering?

Reading AN 9.36, it think it says there are two responses to the sense object of jhana:

  1. The meditator can delight in the jhana, therefore the mind still has the five higher fetters.

  2. The meditator can have no delight towards the jhana, therefore there are no defilements (impurities) arising in the mind of the meditator towards the jhana.

However, i do not read AN 9.36 describe Arahant is attained in the first jhana. Obviously, all Noble Ones (stream-enterer to Arahant) know the experience of The Deathless & Nibbana but for the non-Arahants it is incomplete and can be only a sample. If a stream-enterer did not sample Nibbana, they would not have removed the fetter of doubt. AN 9.36 saying Arahant is attained in the first jhana would make the Noble Eightfold Path and all of the other suttas obsolete. :slightly_smiling_face:

In summary, some of the ideas on this topic could result in the following views:

  1. I am still thinking yet I have attained the 1st jhana.

  2. I think the concepts of impermanence & not-self and these thoughts are vipassana.

  3. I have attained & practised vipassana in the 1st jhana therefore I am an Arahant.

Wonderful!

This particular parallel is found at T1537.26.493c27. There are likely other valuable parallels that were in the Sarvastivada Ekottarika Agama quoted in T1537.

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