Bhikkhu Bodhi on Nibbāna

Hello @Jasudho! :slightly_smiling_face:

You were the first to reply to me on this forum several months ago - since then we have had plenty of discussions regarding this! :wink:

In retrospect I was maybe a little bit too harsh in our countless interactions on this forum, for this I apologize :pray: - I think I was a little bit too passionate about Nibbāna not being eternalism nor ”mere cessation”

I will once again try my best to explain why
Nibbāna is neither ”eternalism” nor ”mere cessation”, here we go again! :sweat_smile:

But the following does indeed conflict with it:

”And how, bhikkhus, do some hold back?

Devas and humans enjoy being, delight in being, are satisfied with being. When Dhamma is taught to them for the cessation of being, their minds do not enter into it or acquire confidence in it or settle upon it or become resolved upon it. Thus, bhikkhus, do some hold back.

“How, bhikkhus, do some overreach?

Now some are troubled, ashamed, and disgusted by this very same being and they rejoice in (the idea of) non-being, asserting: ‘In as much as this self, good sirs, when the body perishes at death, is annihilated and destroyed and does not exist after death—this is peaceful, this is excellent, this is reality!’ Thus, bhikkhus, do some overreach.

If that is not evidence enough that: ”When Dhamma is taught to them for the cessation of being” which means that cessation of being does NOT equal: ”when the body perishes at death, is annihilated and destroyed and does not exist after death—this is peaceful, this is excellent, this is reality!’ Thus, bhikkhus, do some overreach. I don’t know what is (!)

So according to The Buddha himself: full cessation is not this is peaceful, this is excellent, this is reality!”

This is what I’ve been trying to explain all the time in all the various threads where we have discussed this topic. :pray:

And regarding ”all is dukkha”, that is a gradual process to discover for oneself since from Rupa Loka and upwards the planes are exclusively happy with 0% suffering. (The only suffering is that these states come to an end, after million of years - but during its actual phase no suffering whatsoever).

I know you have mentioned before that you don’t care much about these higher planes of existence, but sooner or later you will have to, because this is essential to the path:

Understanding the All
This was said by the Lord…

“Bhikkhus, one who has not directly known and fully understood the ‘All,’who has not detached his mind from it and abandoned it, is incapable of destroying suffering.

But one who has directly known and fully understood the ‘All,’ and who has detached his mind from it and abandoned it, is capable of destroying suffering.”

One who knows the “All” in every way, Who is not attached to anything, Having fully understood the “All”, Has overcome all suffering. > - iti 7

This, having fully understood the “All” goes hand in hand with the following from iti 49 regarding how full cessation is not peaceful, excellent and reality:

“How, bhikkhus, do those with vision see?

Herein a bhikkhu sees what has come to be as having come to be. Having seen it thus, he practises the course for turning away, for dispassion, for the cessation of what has come to be. Thus, bhikkhus, do those with vision see.”

:lotus: :thaibuddha: :lotus: