Is the mindset of a male and muscular development the same thing?
I am a male, that doesn’t mean any tendencies I have or don’t have toward helping people move furniture is related to my maleness, physically or in mindset, right?
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Right. [quote=“LXNDR, post:61, topic:3915”]do you think you have a mindset of a male?
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Ermmm, well I guess that depends on what is the ‘male mindset’. Forgive me if I’ve only known a handful of males well throughout my life but it seems they all had very different mindsets?
Well it’s 6:30 am and I am feeling pretty lazy… But of course if you needed help and I could give it, I would! I wouldn’t be checking down my pants like ‘aw Nup sorry, look I’d love to, but I do not have the required genitals for that!’
It wouldn’t be by any means an unreasonable request for me. I’m pretty strong!
But by the way: I don’t see myself as a man, nor do I want to be one.
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from one another they could differ but i believe they had common traits which would distinguish them from those of females
ok, because a female i wouldn’t approach with such a request and a regular female wouldn’t appreciate such a request either
I thin the muscular strength is caused by your sex, not gender. The gyst of the modern discussion is that the gender is not biocally conditioned. My opinion is that it is partially not true, and I think this opinion is also quite popular among many neurophsychologists - at least those my girlfriend has contact with. Still, muscular strength is not important for the gender discussion in the context of moving furniture, etc., becasuse these things are largely irrelevant for social interactions. It may be important for researching the strategies of conflict management (in my experience conflicts among females involve less physical violence and it may be accounted for by generally diminished muscular strength) and how this is realized in transpeople. If transpeople are ‘born this way’ (and I believe they are) and e.g. identify as women from a relatively yound age despite enormous social pressure to conform, the theory that gender is entirely a social construct looks less plausible.
Well, this is really a bit vague, but there is research showing that male apes and very yound boys tend to interact more with toy cars and stuff like that and are less ‘talkative’ than girls, whereas the female apes and baby girls show more interest in communication and dolls, etc. This is not to say there are no queer-gender or transpeople, of course, or that they are less valuable as human being, or that your mindset is necessarily either male or female, or that you or any other non-conforming people should be criticized, yada-yada-yada… I think you get what I wanna say 
In short, I respect your self-identification and do not suggest it is different from who you think you are. I merely want to say that male and female mindsets, i.e. broad behavioural tendences cause by biology, genetics, and social environment in the majority of biological males and females, most likely is a thing.
Article from a uk broadsheet. The gender police are no doubt horrified:
I think it is okay to raise your kid as gender neutral as long as you are okay with raising your kid as a typical female or typical male. Otherwise it can create a situation a bit similar to what we observe in certain feminist circles from time to time where free adult and informed women are criticized or at least looked down upon for deciding to stay housewives and raise kids (I personally know very many people who look down on soccer mums) or people say there is no reverse sexism, etc. If you really really want it, raise your kid as gender neutral, but just don’t say gender stereotyping or people who raise there kids this way are stupid , it sort of defeats the purpose.
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Wow…Yikes…Egad…Okay…fascinating!
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I am not gender police but the article "horrified"me in a similar manner to when I learned as a university student of B. F. Skinner doing psychology experiments on his own young daughter (whoops! infant) in the 1920s in his ‘Skinners’ Box’.
The article sounded more like an experiment of the parents to me rather than an exercise in having the child make their own choices. Instead of the parents dressing the child as a boy or girl, it would have sounded more child-centred to me if the parents asked the child (periodically) which clothing the child would like to wear, which toys would they like to play with, etc. I got the impression the parents were zealously imposing their personal views upon the child in an authoritarian manner.
They referred to their child as “The Infant” and only allowed him to play with “gender-neutral toys” in their television-free home.
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Indeed this sounds antithetical to allowing free gendered expression. One can only observe the behavioral implications of this kind of experiment as it continues to manifest in the life of the subject. . It reminds me of the way choice is given to the parents of intersexed babies: involving an arbitrary decision y the parents often based more on parental prejudice and expectation, than allowing for freedom of gendered expression.
And while I find the discussion fascinating, I do have a more colorful perspective as America’s third gender, and what I know based on my experience is that all genders [which are essentially labels] serve society as a whole more than the individual. And all genders hold their own unique brand of suffering. I have had the exquisite pleasure of experiencing a wide range of gender based suffering first as an adolescent boy in the public school system, then as a queer androgynous boy-rejected by family and friends in the 1970’s- eventually as a Transwoman in transition, and finally as a woman.
My goal is to affirm the suffering of all the labels and categories that seek to restrict and confine us in little boxes of tightly held behavioral standards with social expectations arbitrary in their design, and nuanced to the point of absurdity as in the gendered designations of everything including colors. Ever ask yourself why is pink a girl’s color? Why there are limitations on the limpness of a male wrist? Why do women carry purses, and why do words like fag and bitch carry such a heavy emotional implication?
Postulated: These are society’s Boxes designing to sell you gender based commodity, and behavioral expectations which in totality create the illusion of separateness between humans for the sake of control. The real difference in the sexes is hormonal. Stripping gender away from sex-or deconstructing Nurture aka our conditioning -is the only way to arrive at one’s true center. This will no doubt require several rebirths. In the mean time I acknowledge the suffering of both sexes and wish only for our liberation as human beings.
Namaste with metta!!!
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I very much admire your ‘walk’ through this material world. May you find liberation as you walk.
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lol…You can’t make statements like that. So if a lady did appreciate it, then you’d say, by your rational, she is not a regular lady. . ugggh…I’m sure you don’t mean that.
regularity is measured by frequency of occurrence, if out of 100 women 1 isn’t surprised by my request and even goes to fulfill it, it follows that she’s special in some respect, in this case either stronger and more robust than average or more open minded about gender roles, or considering herself not a female, or something else
I wasn’t questioning a sociological observation. I was pointing to a philosophical issue:
Just because something is ‘regular’ or a societal norm or socially acceptable, doesn’t ipso facto make it good or right; and just because something goes against mainstream society doesn’t ipso facto make it bad or wrong. I take it you accept that?
Seriously? A regular female? I’m speechless [which is rare for me! ]LOL
Of course…my fault, I replied in the wrong place. But thanks and I hope you are doing well. Now for this fortuitous link. Watching the news on my Roku, I was intrigued by a blip about a ‘gay Buddhist’. And of course my reaction is that this person manifested a contradiction, not in the fact that he is gay but there exists a certain flamboyance, a celebration of ego which I interpret as not representative of the true nature of Buddhism. Furthermore there was little mention of the sort of Buddhism which Kodo Nishimura practices. I am wondering without doing in depth research if he is more of a self proclaimed monk. I will post the links, and then ask for your opinion as to whether I should share it with the membership at large via the Watercooler.
And sorry bout the misplaced reply.
Namaste con Metta,
"Monks and makeup artistry don’t generally go hand in hand (that we know of), and Nishimura told BuzzFeed News that he did experience a period of doubt about doing both. But ultimately, at his mentor’s urging, he decided to go for it. “It isn’t wrong if it helps you deliver your message to people,” Nishimura said.
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Hi Rosie,
I read the articles and they made me smile and made my day! I thought he (she?) was a darling and if that is her way, then good for her. I would say to him…you go girl!
As long as we are not hurting ourselves or others, then we should be free to express ourselves in anyway we want. It is sort of horrific that people might want to stop him.
Thanks, but I don’t recall anyone trying to stop him.
I’m sure they are out there .
Well, sure, he can do whatever he thiks is beneficial for him as long as it is not harmful to others, but I don’t really think that being a monk and a make-up artist at the same time makes much sense. Rejecting the enticing power of the physical beauty is a more difficult feat than rejecting violence or ill-will because it is a less obvious thing to do, but the Buddha is very clear about it being necessary. In other words, having a career as a make-up artist and being a devout lay Buddhist is 100% within the realm of possibility, but it doesn’t really rhyme well with the monastic path.
An 1.11 (trans. by Ven. Bodhi):
“Bhikkhus, I do not see even one other thing on account of which unarisen sensual desire arises and arisen sensual desire increases and expands so much as the mark of the attractive. For one who attends carelessly to the mark of the attractive, unarisen sensual desire arises and arisen sensual desire increases and expands.”