Discernment challenge 😎

[Thaniyo_Bhikkhu]

@DCM

write up your experience of, and nature of the 5 Aggregates

Before I begin and before you read my description, I suggest you write down your own description first, so as not to be influenced by mine.
The point is not to get the right answers but to be able to get the right base(yoniso manasikara) established, so that the right answers(parato ca ghosa) will become apparent (sanditthiko).

There are two conditions for the arising of right view:
“Dve kho, āvuso, paccayā sammādiṭṭhiyā uppādāya—
the words of another and knowledge of the ground by which attention is .
parato ca ghoso, yoniso ca manasikāro." MN43

On the meaning of yoniso

The rendering of the Pali term yoniso poses a number of difficulties, some of which which I have discussed in previous posts. I will mention again the major issues, together with a new text that well illustrates the main point. It is from the root yoni, meaning “womb” and by extension “source”. It seems that the non-Buddhist sources only know this meaning, and that the usage in Buddhism is quite distinct. It is an ablative adverb functioning as an indeclinable (cp. sabbaso, bhiyyoso), conveyin…

It is said “Five aggregates, five aggregates”, what is " five aggregates?

There are five aggregates which constitute the entirety of my experience and so I will refer to them as ‘THIS’ meaning the ‘five-aggregates’ as one thing.
THIS is a thing, my whole experience. It is a general thing.
It is my whole situation, not the particular parts within.

I see, hear, smell, taste, touch, think. I feel. I intend. I am typing. There is movement. There is stillness. There is attention…all of that is encompassed by THIS, the situation as a whole.

Those particular things within THIS, I will refer to as this.
I can’t call it that because that would leave ‘me’ out.
I am included in the term this. I am also a particular part encompassed by THIS.

THIS I cannot perceive directly, even as I think THIS…that is a thought about THIS which is a part of this.
I can only know THIS as a kind of significance of this.
this points to THIS.
Wherever I look I whatever I think, that is all within the situation as a whole.
The knowledge of THIS, is in a way, a higher knowledge, literally higher. It is not something I can pay attention to. It is behind attention while I attend to this typing.
It is the behind my thinking as I think about this description.
I can only know it indirectly on account of this.

The source of my attention cannot be attended to but I can know it indirectly while I am attending.

What I attend to is in front, the foreground.
That foreground is this.
The foreground indicates the background.
If I imagine " if that foreground was not here", I can’t now imagine how I could know of THIS background.
I can’t even now imagine THIS background without _this_foreground.
They seem inseparable but not joined.
When there is the background, there is the foreground.
When there is the foreground, there is the background.
“With THIS, this is”

The THIS is there unmoving, but it IS just there. It’s beginning I cannot remember. It has manifested and as such, it is manifested. It endures.
It is more apparent to me now, not like before I started typing I could say that, its apparentness is increasing while it endures.

THIS is manifested and this is manifested.
I cannot imagine one without the other.
I cannot grasp that background, its beyond my grasp.

Where are perceptions? In front
Where is attention? Behind perceptions pointing forwards
Where are intentions? All around perceptions , directing attention. (There are infinite possibilities, but only a few get attended to)
Where is feeling? Behind perceptions, behind attention, behind intentions, undirected, not pointing anywhere
Where is form/rupa? Unperceivable, unattendable, further behind or even below/beyond this. Inconceivable.

All that this is there within THIS.
The THIS is undeniable. It IS even if I don’t want it to be. It is even if I want more of it. It is indifferent to me or this
It has manifested, which indicates the opposite of what it is.
It indicates the ‘possibility of non-manifestation’.
The sign of ‘possibility of non- manifestation’ has manifested on account of the manifested.
Or
THIS indicates its negative i.e its possibility of cessation, NOT-THIS.

I think I will stop there and leave you with the following sutta:

MN38
“Bhikkhus, do you see: ‘THIS has manifested’?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”—“Bhikkhus, do you see: ‘Its manifestation occurs with that this as nutriment’?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”—“Bhikkhus, do you see: ‘With the(possibility of)cessation of that this nutriment, what has manifested is subject to the (possibility of )cessation’?”—“Yes, venerable sir

Bhikkhus, does doubt arise when one is uncertain thus: ‘Has THIS manifested’?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”—“Bhikkhus, does doubt arise when one is uncertain thus: ‘Does its manifestation occur with that this as nutriment’?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”—“Bhikkhus, does doubt arise when one is uncertain thus: ‘With the possibility of cessation of that this nutriment, is what has manifested subject to possibility of cessation’?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”

“Bhikkhus, is doubt abandoned in one who sees as it actually is with right understanding thus: ‘THIS has manifested’?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”—“Bhikkhus, is doubt abandoned in one who sees as it actually is with right understanding thus: ‘Its manifestation occurs with that this as nutriment’?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”—“Bhikkhus, is doubt abandoned in one who sees as it actually is with right understanding thus: ‘With the (possibility of)cessation of that this nutriment, what has manifested is subject to possibility of cessation’?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”

“Bhikkhus, are you thus free from doubt here: ‘This has manifested’?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”—“Bhikkhus, are you thus free from doubt here: ‘Its manifestation occurs with that this as nutriment’?” —“Yes, venerable sir.”—“Bhikkhus, are you thus free from doubt here: ‘With the possibility of cessation of that this nutriment, what has manifested is subject to cessation’?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”

“Bhikkhus, has it been seen well by you as it actually is with right understanding thus: ‘This has manifested’?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”—“Bhikkhus, has it been seen well by you as it actually is with right understanding thus: ‘Its manifestation occurs with that this as nutriment’?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”—“Bhikkhus, has it been seen well by you as it actually is with right understanding thus: ‘With the possibility of cessation of that this nutriment, what has manifested is subject to possibility of cessation’?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”

“Bhikkhus, purified and bright as this view is, if you adhere to it, cherish it, treasure it, and treat it as a possession, would you then understand that the Dhamma has been taught as similar to a raft, being for the purpose of crossing over, not for the purpose of acquiring?”—“No, venerable sir.”—“Bhikkhus, purified and bright as this view is, if you do not adhere to it, cherish it, treasure it, and treat it as a possession, would you then understand that the Dhamma has been taught as similar to a raft, being for the purpose of crossing over, not for the purpose of acquisition?”—“Yes, venerable sir.”