Question on sutta segment IDs

Would someone please be able to explain how to translate “MN.i.108” to a segment ID? I’m looking at the following text:

A Sākiyan of Kapilavatthu. It is recorded MN.i.108 that Daṇḍapāṇi once met the Buddha in Kapilavatthu and questioned him on his teachings. The Buddha explained them to him, but he was not satisfied, and went away “shaking his head, wagging his tongue, with his brow puckered into three wrinkles.”

I’m guessing MN.i.108 is another way of refering to the given sentence in MN18. Is there some logic that can be used to convert between this old notation to the new “segment ID” form of notation?

The Sutta you’re looking for is the Ball of Honey


This is Majhima Nikkaya, volume 1, page 108 of the Pali Text Society edition.

There is a system. It’s complicated. You might find (parts of) this post helpful.

Btw you can enable Pali text society references in the views screen but there isn’t a direct way to search using the pts numbers, as apparently it’s quite complicated!

Thank you Bhante. I’m trying to do this programatically, so the complexity factor may not be as much of an obstacle. Is this something I can implement if given the logic?

Another question - would you (or anyone else) know if the dictionary of Pali proper names only uses the PTS numbering scheme, or does it use multiple schemes?

If it was simple you can trust that it would have already been done!

Bhante @sujato might be able to give you a technical reason.

Dictionary of Pali Proper Names uses the PTS references.

Hi Chaz,
There is code available that does the conversions: PTS Converter.

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Ahh! That’s right this is fairly new I remember now but not going to be integrated here?

Took me to the wrong Sutta but close enough!

I think that MN18 start in the middle of Page 108, so the start of page Mi.108 is still MN17.

The new version here takes you directly to the top of the page, if you enter M i 108 in the search box and click on the Sujato translation.

Lol yes I know how it works, I’m old enough to remember pages! :laughing: Wish there was a more precise system!

Oooh! Thank you so much, I’ll take a closer look at that.

You can find source code for one such converter here: GitHub - benmneb/pts-converter: 📚 PTS reference to sutta number converter

The json map is this file: pts-converter/pts_lookup.json at master · benmneb/pts-converter · GitHub

That’s really great, thanks for pointing that out. I’m looking at the JSON file now but I can’t work out how to find “Thag.868-870” in there. The text is:

“Aṅgulimāla was converted by the Buddha’s power and received the “ehi bhikkhu pabbajjā ” Thag.868–870 while the populace were yelling at the king’s palace for the robber’s life.”

There isn’t even an 868 in the whole file…any clues what this is referring to? Sorry, this is the first time I’m working with Pali text numbering and so on…

You may want to visit this site that search all pali text in suttacentral and pts

I tried…typing “Thag.868” as the search query just froze my browser. At the same time, I’m guessing this is just looking up the JSON map that was posted above, am I right?

I try typing 'thag"

And I got result: Thag Vīsatinipāto (705-948)

The link to suttacentral is

I guess that verse number is somewhere in there, I dont know how to see the verse number, other than counting it manually