Is it only because they would be revealing attainments or are there other reasons?
Yeah, thatâs the main reason as I understand it.
2 Likes
Thank you! Why is it such a serious offense to reveal attainments? And why isnât it a problem to reveal the attainments of other monks who have already passed away?
Is it just to prevent people from falsly claiming them to get a cult following?
1 Like
Well, revealing your attainments truthfully is a Pacittaya, so a middle-class offense. Same category as e.g. getting into a fight with another monk. People tend to treat it very seriously though because intentionally lying about having attainments is a Parajika: instant defeat. So, since even telling the truth is also an offense, itâs much safer to just avoid the whole topic.
The offense though is worded in such a way as to only cover âyour ownâ attainments.
As to why the Buddha made the Vinaya like this, who am I to guess the intentions of the Buddha?
I can say that the Theravada origin story mentions monks who wished to get food during a famine. So âcult followingâ is probably part of it. (Which is also possible even when talking about your e.g. deceased master! Though perhaps there the âsecond handâ nature of the claim makes it âsaferâ in a way?)
The way I see it is that people either believe you or they donât. If they believe you, it becomes a cult-like thing and if they donât believe you thatâs equally a problem: âProve it!â âPhony!â âFake!â âCharlatan!!â⌠not very good karma for the skeptic to make either! So, best to just stick to the Dhamma: the four noble truths and the way out of all such messes.
8 Likes
âWhy canât monks talk about their past lives?â
Because most monastics have no insights into their own past lives. Being a monastic is one thing; being an ariyapuggala monastic is far less common; and, being an ariyapuggala monastic with attainments that include such a power is far less common indeed.
Thank you! I thought revealing such attainment is a Parajika offense in both cases, thatâs why I misunderstood the rule.
2 Likes
One need not be enlightened to have the ability to recall their past lives. Indeed, past life recall doesnât even necessarily translate into mundane right view! See: DN1
7 Likes
Even children can do it! 
5 Likes
Agreed, youâre right that past life recall isnât limited to enlightened individuals and doesnât automatically mean they have mundane right view; though for the sake of brevity, I was speaking in reference from the perspective of attainments along the Buddhism path. 
That being the context, in response to the OP about why monastics donât talk about their past lives, whether itâs because it would be akin to speaking about attainments or âif there are other reasons,â my answer had more to do with the later. 
For the most part, many monastics may not have direct insights into their own past lives and so talking about it would be⌠unskilful at best. 
I totally get where youâre coming from, and I appreciate the mention of DN1; thank you bhante.
I originally thought the rule against revealing attainments was about good character hygiene. Avoiding monastics getting big heads, bragging, thinking they are special, etc.
Many years ago in another Buddhist Internet forum ( I donât have any more âproofâ than that ) someone told me the rule is about monastics without attainments not getting enough food, clothing, medicine, etc as monastics with attainments.
2 Likes
I did not want to open a new thread because it is tangentially related, and itâs a bit of a loaded question:
Why donât monks gather information from past lives / other realms that could help Humanity? For instance, if there is a technology in some alien world or deva realm which allows for the mitigation of the effects of climate change, wouldnât that be useful to bring back to Earth? Or maybe just share it in some way that does not reveal the power itself?
Or if there was a historical debate on something a monk took part in in their past lives wouldnât it be helpful if they revealed how that event happened? I understand that this would only convince a few people of the existence of past lives, because if an event can be verified, then one can say that they just got the information from that source, and if it can not be verified one could argue that it is just made up, but still. I would still enjoy hearing about how the dinosaurs went extinct for instance and wait for science to confirm it later on.
To my knowledge there is nothing recorded about monastics having past lives on extraterrestrial worlds, so they couldnât give us a technological cheat sheet. To my non-expert knowledge devas donât use any technology, they have what they want through âmagicâ.
Climate change isnât a technological program. Subscribe to the right periodical and you can regularly read articles about new green technologies. Climate change is driven by human defilements, desire.
Monastics arenât allowed to talk about their attainments.
1 Like
In Thailand there are a number of such âmiracle curesâ, mostly medicines. One of them, Yaa Som, was a recipe a famous monk claimed the devas gave to him for curing/preventing cancer. It is made by slowly dissolving various metals and other things in an extremely strong acid. Youâre supposed to dissolve a couple drops of the stuff in a glass of water to drink it. Unfortunately, the layman who offered me a bottle failed to inform me of that! I got some serious chemical burns to my gums and lips before I managed to spit it out 
The laymen at least got a jolly good laugh out of it.
5 Likes
Maybe, and maybe not 
I imagine, helped by intuition and reason, that revelations like âpast lifeâ is very complicated to convey by words alone, and a safe answer is to point to dependent origination here and now, because it can be experienced in silent togetherness.
Edit: Came to think about subtle/mystical experiences, and that these are best kept as a personal secret. Not to close off for any responses, but more for own safety. Memory isnât reliable, and reasoning canât grasp beond thought, so in the case of a true experience, I guess it will stay firm and become more visible if left as it is, and when one retells ones own version, this will be a deluded construct that shines brighter with each repetition, and twists or mask the truth.
As with so many other issues, the causes are often multi-factorial.
From my personal experience [as a layperson/unordained civilian], when I speak out about certain attainments, even if true, I feel uneasy, and it often happens that I lose some - if not all - of what was attained or discovered.
At this point in time, after a fair amount of reflection, I have realized that the moment I speak about those gains to someone, I identify with the gains, and grasp them. What I further found interesting is that, in the mere occurrence of âlosingâ this faculty (or having no more access to it), it is presented to me as a warning of some sort. It took me a long time to understand why and to what this was aligned with. My most current understanding is that I have values deep down within me (which I deny) that are against identification with these attainments. Grasping these gains narrow done my focus and distract me from the path. Inevitably, the moment I realize that I lost access to those attainments, I suffer - another âsignâ that my actions and view were not right. It was not straightforward to me though, because I thought I was speaking truthfully and talked about them at a time and place and with a person I judged to be right.
With hindsight, I think this is not much dissimilar to the advice of not taking alcohol - one is surrounded by other persons who also drink, complete with alcohol-laden social events and adverts all around - what would be wrong with having one beer? Over time you realize that deep down you donât really like the bitter taste of the beer, but had been desperately conforming for fear of missing out. Most importantly, you realize that this action has negligible benefit to deepening your spiritual growth, and then wonder why everyone else is still drinking beer and enjoying it. In summary, talking about past lives - or other aspects that are distracting - is not likely to deepen the spiritual trajectory and therefore is a waste of time and energy, and possibly a few steps backwards too. The risk of identifying with those attainments may be high for some to the extent of veering off-course.
1 Like