When you click that button, a sort of grid pops out. Then you drag across the number of rows and columns youâd like in your table (in my case, 2 x 1, which highlight as you drag):
SN 36.21 has the âvâ button that when clicked, gives a dropdown menu from which you can get to the PÄli. You can see the âvâ button on the far right, now inverted since I clicked on it.
Below it, SN 36.22 does not have that âvâ button, so far as I can see. I cannot find a way to get to the PÄli. And actually, even on the dropdown menu for 21, the items such as âSN 36.21â are not clickable.
Am I looking in the wrong place? And if the âvâ button really is the place to go to find the PÄli, why have it only on some suttas, not others?
(this is not a bug, but I didnât see a thread for minor problems, and I didnât want to contribute to proliferation of single threads for each minor problem. Please feel free to relocate this message)
First of all, congratulations to the Sutta Central Team, Bhante Sujato for the free english translations of four nikayas, this is a monumental achievement and a great moment in history!
So hereâs my complaint, about sutta numbering:
The old suttacentral had a clear, simple numbering system of the nikaya hierarchy making it easy to find suttas by the modern numbering method.
In the new way, the modern sutta ref. numbers are buried down in the hierarchy, so even someone like me, who is pretty familiar with much of the nikaya, I have to go treasure hunting opening and closing different pali hierarchies guessing at where the final sutta Iâm looking for resides in. SN in particular is difficult.
It would be great if the modern sutta ref. numbers were directly embedded throughout the entire nikaya hierarchy so thereâs no guesswork. It would only add a few more alphanumeric characters for the hierarchy labels, and is well worth the real estate cost, IMO. I assume the numbers were left out for aesthetics and real estate reasons.
No, the âVâ button gets you to the parallels-table. Not to the pali. SN36.22 does not have any parallels associated with it so there is no button.
The pali text for SN36.21, etc. as well as Bhante Sujatoâs translations are not yet uploaded so you cannot see the pali for these texts yet. We hope to get to that soon.
Normally, the pali text, when itâs there, appears in the Translations part of the suttaplex under âMoreâ, where it now says âHeckerâ because the german translation is on top of the list. Normally the Pali would be on top of the list and it will be once we have uploaded it.
On the old site, the SN was divided into 56 Samyuttas. Now these 56 are (numbered) inside the respective vaggas where they belong. So yes, this is one extra step there. But you can then click on that same Samyutta as you were used to and get the list for all the suttas within that Samyutta just the same as the old site. If you donât want to, you donât have to open all the sub-menu-items. You can simply open the whole Samyutta like for instance https://suttacentral.net/sn47 opens the whole list for SN47 just like the old site did here: https://legacy.suttacentral.net/sn47.
(alternatively you can also open the whole vagga above that and open a whole set of samyuttas)
The issue I mentioned in the âWeâre live!â thread and that was fixed for the desktop site appears to persist on my mobile device. Hereâs my post from that thread:
Not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but in the top left corner of the forums there is this (look at the top left above âDiscuss & Discoverâ):
I have no issues with this behaviour when already scrolling up and down (it is indeed useful for the top toolbar to hide and show dynamically like that). But when I manually input an URL into the browser I expected to see the paragraph on the top and not hidden under the toolbar This is probably a very low impact bug but still an UI bug.
I get that ellipsis at the end of SC 19 stands for SC 20 in Pali, it is just that there is no SC 20 marker in the English translation (this is what I meant with âmissingâ). I understand the technical reason for that (ellipsis is actually part of SC 19 translated text and not a separate para.
Here the numbering is not in sync (SC 17.1, .2, .3 â SC 21); and here it is broken (SC 17.4 + ellipsis â SC 22 and SC 23). Is there even supposed to be an SC 17.4?
Or am I missing something?
I would characterize the positioning of the gear button (Text Settings) at the top of each sutta as an UI bug: it belongs to the top toolbar since it controls the global settings (switches view on or off for all the suttas).
Also the access to the other two buttons at the top of the sutta (Info and Parallels) is difficult when one is reading a long sutta and wishes to display the original text at the present position (you have to move focus to the top and lose current position).
Also, there is no UI element that leads to the top/bottom (keyboard shortcuts donât count, please do not forget many users will use SC on tablets and smartphones with touch interface).
It would be better to show the beginning paragraph or the # referenced paragraph of the referenced sutta. This is probably something that is beyond D&D control since oneboxing is core discourse feature, but perhaps it can be tweaked somehow specifically for SC links posted on D&D?
I think I agree with @frankk. We used to see a nice table, with both the systems of numbering, side by side. So we could look up the new, and the old PTS referencing system. Perhaps there is a way to display both simultaneously in the new system also? Frankk, is that what you were asking for?
Not everyone has those memorised, and most people will be looking from having got references in PÄli, such as âMN 2â , âSN 32.4â, and so on. And not everyone knows what those are in English, so just having the English there wonât actually help them.
Also just an unrelated thing that I experienced writing this message - it could be very handy on this forum, for the âcommand+zâ shortcut to undo our actions when writing. Just a thought⊠it usually works on other sites and apps, but not here for some reason.
I was talking about the button shaped like a âVâ with a small green circle with a number at the top of it.
The menu dropdown also has a small button next to it that looks like a down-arrow but not actually like the letter âVâ because it is closed. It looks more like a triangle.
The second view with the numbers 17.1, etc. is the segment numbers. This shows in line-by-line view for instance; texts that are specifically marked as segments and translated per segment. But I will ask about the deviation of numbers because it seems indeed that they should be the same.
We are working on that but Iâve run into some problems there. What we want is to have a specific sutta-blurb for each sutta there.
Questions/suggestions regarding design and behavior I refer to Bhante Sujato because he is the designer of the site.
Both the new and old PTS referencing system is there in each of the suttaplex cards. If you hover over various elements in the card, it will give you specific extra information for each one. On the old site there was a lot of information that could not be displayed properly like what the Sutta is about, parallels, etc.
Unfortunately that does not work very well because we also want to display other languages than Pali like Chinese, Sanskrit, etc. and they are not called DÄ«gha, etc. There have been long discussion about these issues so this is what was decided upon. Many people also do not know what DÄ«gha means for instance and there are issue of space to be considered too.
You mean for the page of the individual sutta? Because if you want to find one from a reference, you donât want to have to go right down the heirarchy and click on each individual sutta until you eventually find it. If I remember correctly, on the old site, you could simply scroll down the list until you saw the sutta which corresponded to your reference. That is impossible now, right? Unless Iâm missing somethingâŠ
I addressed that point already:
Yes, but most people who are searching for a sutta by using the heirarchy, will be doing so with a reference derived from the PÄli, such as âDN 2â. So, regarding searching the heirarchy, PÄli would seem to be the most important to display. But both surely are valuable.
Would abbreviating the Indic, as I suggested above, resolve that? Because it would surely help people in navigating the site.
And if that takes up too much space, even one additional letter would be kind to people trying to navigate the site. That would cover PÄli and Chinese:
No, the list of suttas is a list of what we call suttaplex cards. The same info for the chosen sutta is also at the top of the individual suttas but you can also see it in the list.
Thank you for reporting this issue. There are more issues with the themeâs layout, but we will not be dealing with the CSS of the Forum Theme just yet. This is just a theme, nothing has changed other than the looks of the forum. Bhante Sujato will take care of the CSS in the next few weeks. In the mean time, if you have problems, you can revert back to the old theme in your preferences.
Oh Iâm sorry @Vimala, I found the system I used to use for seeing all suttas in both reference systems, in one list. SOrry for the confusion. Here is an example: https://suttacentral.net/dn
@frankk, is that what you wre looking for? When you said this:
Yes, indeed. Except that for the DN as in your example, there are no alternative PTS numbers, so if you hover over the volume/page number DN i 1, it just shows you Volume and Page and if you hover over the other number it says âSuttaCentral IDâ.
If you however go to another one like https://suttacentral.net/an10-pancamapannasaka, it also tells you the Alternate Number in the PTS edition (which was the numbers in square brackets on the old site: https://legacy.suttacentral.net/an10.
Note there are still a few issues with the numbering at AN and SN and weâre working on that.
Thanks Ayya, just note that unless I load SC in Desktop site mode I cannot zoom in/out.
I cross fingers your report to the Polymer people yields results!