Report bugs for the new site here! 🐛

[Subharo]

Strange, persistent, unbidden highlighting seen in Chromium. About 5 suttas read in a row (just proceeding to the next sutta at the bottom of the page, each time), all decided to keep completely highlighting themselves. This continued even across a reboot! And the highlighting wouldn’t disappear, even if I dragged across the text (expecting to make new highlighting).

On the left is Firefox, on the right is Chromium, where the highlighting somehow got “frozen on”:

Note: In the Gear menu, turning side-by-side off and back on fixed it.

[sujato]

Wow, that’s … something. I think for now we should mark it as a curio, please let us know if it recurs.

[Subharo]

I don’t know how I caused it. So I can’t explain how to reproduce it. I wasn’t doing anything unusual which I could suggest as causing it.

[Santacari]

Hello
At my sutta discussion group the following problems were seen.
1
ipad and Mac users could not see the site at all in safari or in a different browser [I think it was firefox]

Checked again today mac laptop and safari and the site was blank.

2 when printing from windows 10 or android part of text is off the sides of the page [side by side pali English view] or off the bottom of the page [line by line p&e or english only]
Changing paper size, margins, orientation didn’t help.
Also the default was that the menu printed over the top of the first page. When I carefull made sure the menu was retracted before printing, then half the time it didn’t obscure the page and half the time it did.

• am making printouts so the Mac and Ipad users can see the text.

[Santacari]

I don’t know if here is the place for this as it is not a bug but a request.

In Bhikkhu Bodhi’s translation he puts … for repetition. I see this has been reproduced in Bhikkhu Sujato’s work.

Would it be possible to translate in Full and put all of the repetitions in please?
Much of the pedagogic effect and affect is lost without those repetitions.
The repetitions surely show us emphasis on the things we need to remember.

When going through MN19 recently it was particularly obvious.

Please put the repetitions back in.
thank you very much

[sujato]

Hi Ayya,

@Santacari

ipad and Mac users could not see the site at all in safari

Old versions of Safari are not supported. If it is a recent version, please let us know the version number.

@Santacari

printing

These are known bugs are we will address them when we get the chance.

@Santacari

repetition

The abbreviations are mostly in the original Pali text, as you can see by viewing text and translation side by side. When translating, we use our best judgement to ensure the abbreviations are handled as well as possible, sometimes adjusting the manuscript choices. But no edition in print or manuscript spells out all abbreviations in full, and to reconstitute a full edition would require thousands of hours work. If there are specific instances that you think should be looked at, please cite them precisely and explain why they should be handled differently.

[Linda]

Dear Ayye @ Santacari

I use a Mac with OS 10.10. and Safari 10.1.2 and the new SC site does not work with it. It did for a short while but the last few weeks again has not; it’s just blank. So I use the old site but unfortuanately then can’t see Bhante @ Sujato’s new translations (nor the Pali side by side which is such a great feature)

[stu]

@sujato

But no edition in print or manuscript spells out all abbreviations in full, and to reconstitute a full edition would require thousands of hours work.

Interesting! Thank you Bhante @sujato .

Now that we (humanity) has the ability to hide and reveal large portions of text at the click of a button, do you think that this (reconstitute a full edition) might be a project worth undertaking in the future?

[Santacari]

Thank you Bhante Sujato, I can see how you might wish to finiiish this phase of the project before launching into a new expanded scope.

But here is the particular example that brought this up for me - MN19 which I revisit fairly often as I mainly teach beginners.

3 3Then, as I meditated—diligent, keen, and resolute—a sensual thought arose. I understood: ‘This sensual thought has arisen in me. It leads to hurting myself, hurting others, and hurting both. It blocks wisdom, it’s on the side of anguish, and it doesn’t lead to extinguishment.’ When I reflected that it leads to hurting myself, it went away. When I reflected that it leads to hurting others, it went away. When I reflected that it leads to hurting both, it went away. When I reflected that it blocks wisdom, it’s on the side of anguish, and it doesn’t lead to extinguishment, it went away. So I gave up, got rid of, and eliminated any sensual thoughts that arose.

4-54Then, as I meditated—diligent, keen, and resolute—a malicious thought arose … a cruel thought arose. I understood: ‘This cruel thought has arisen in me. It leads to hurting myself, hurting others, and hurting both. It blocks wisdom, it’s on the side of anguish, and it doesn’t lead to extinguishment.’ When I reflected that it leads to hurting myself … hurting others … hurting both, it went away. When I reflected that it blocks wisdom, it’s on the side of anguish, and it doesn’t lead to extinguishment, it went away. So I gave up, got rid of, and eliminated any cruel thoughts that arose.

---

that part
4-54 Then, as I meditated—diligent, keen, and resolute—a malicious thought arose … a cruel thought arose.

as we read through it, we accidentally missed that it was two things in the first pass
[yes I know a little more mindfulness would help]

Going over again the amazing incredible step by step process that the Blessed one gives us to eliminate toxic thinking is just so useful to so many people.
Repeating it three times is quite special.

I’ll mention some others if you like as well.

Oh and I was wondering if I could help at all with the dictionary

[sujato]

@stu

do you think that this (reconstitute a full edition) might be a project worth undertaking in the future?

As have mentioned before on this site somewhere, this is a huge and complex task that could only be undertaken by a genuine expert in Pali who is also tech-savvy. Of which there are, well, not many. Maybe one or two? Even so, for a dedicated expert working full time, I would estimate maybe 1 or 2 years work. So no, it’s not going to happen.

@Santacari

as we read through it, we accidentally missed

Yes, see this is the problem. You want to catch this issue. Sure! But it is, in fact, indicated in the text, so yes, more careful reading would solve this.

But say we spelled out the repetitions. Then there is a big blob of repetitious text. You’ve added a whole bunch of stuff that’s the same, and ask the reader to plough through lots of boring repetitions to filter out the one word that is different. That is no less difficult and error-prone a task than recognizing the occurrence of elisions.

There’s a reason why all printed editions use abbreviations. Without them, the texts rapidly become unreadable. Picking one or two passages that you think would be better spelled out is easy. But understanding the implications of doing that everywhere is a different matter entirely.

If you want to spell out a specific passage in full, you’re most welcome! Hey, if someone wants to make a “full text” edition, with all or many repetitions spelled out, we would consider hosting that. But it’s not something we will be spending time on.

@Santacari

Oh and I was wondering if I could help at all with the dictionary

Well, thank you. What kind of thing were you think of? We’re not actively working dictionaries at the moment. The only outstanding job is the markup and corrections to the old PTS dictionary.

You can see the old thread on this here:

Major upgrade to PTS dictionary

Hi Waiyin, Yes, abbreviations are a problem. There are very many of them, and they are not always listed in the Dictionary, nor are they always consistent. More to the point, they are only really relevant in a print context, and—with the exception of well-known, standard abbreviations such as “etc.”, “i.e.” and so on—I would rather spell them all out. In fact I have already done so to some degree, and have just added “Ep.” to that, so next time the dictionary is updated it will read “epithet” …

And a list of 2-do items here:

Roadmap for further enhancements to PTS Dictionary

Warning! This is a big, complex, slow, and thankless task!

[jllewi]

Search, Suttas, Chrome, Win10. Sometimes (not always repeatable) a second search will show the first searches results. This continues until refreshing the page (F5).

[sujato]

Thanks for the report. We’ve dealt with this kind of issue a few times, but we thought we had it sorted out. It’s hard to test when it’s not repeatable. If you discover any other patterns in the error, let us know.

[tkk]

Again something related to Safari (macOS 10.13.4, Safari 11.1; iOS 11.3.0 and 11.3.1).
While the diacritics-problem persists, I switched to Devanagari-Script for Pāḷi and observed something like a marker, normally used when inputting compounded characters (don’t know, whether this is the correct term). See screenshot. This occurs, when two "ā"s meet inside a word. I tested this with Firefox, which (again) is fine.

SN45.1

SuttaCentral

[Vimala]

Interesting bug. Can you check if the same bug appears here:

Pāli text of SN 45.1, “Avijjāsutta”

[tkk]

Dear Ayya,
it’s the same with the legacy version (macOS and iOS). But I recognized something else too: The legacy version has consecutive consonants with a ligature, while the new version shows them with the vowels muted (virāma) - I don’t know, whether this is just an alternative (20 years ago I learned this script , but used it only very rarely).

[Vimala]

@tkk

it’s the same with the legacy version (macOS and iOS)

Then this has probably something to do with Safari not rendering the font correctly and not connected with the new site then. I don’t have this problem on my system.

@tkk

has consecutive consonants with a ligature,

Yes, I vaguely recall we made a few changes with regards to that for the new site somewhere last year.

[Bernat]

Pali lookup isn’t working, using Firefox 59.0.2. It works if I switch to Safari or Waterfox. However, in Waterfox there is the following problem. Look how beautiful

This happened sometimes in the past (on Firefox, when the lookup worked), a bubble stayed, but going over the word again made it disappear. Now it got a bit crazy…

[sujato]

I’m also using FF 59, and I don’t see that problem. Hmm.

Well, FF 60 has just been released, and it has native support for web components. May I suggest you upgrade to that when you can, and hopefully the problem will go away. Meanwhile, if you need to use the function, Chrome works well.

[Bernat]

It’s quite strange actually. If I have an English translation with the Pali side by side it works, but if I’m only looking at the Pali it doesn’t… I’ll try upgrading or using other navigators.

[sujato]

Huh, well that is strange. But it might explain how it slipped past our testing.