Stratification of the Suttas

Just one more thing, I was attempting to do some research to help explain the Yamaka Sutta raised in this thread:

Before I realised that the OP was perhaps pulling our collective leg a little and was not in fact seeking info on that rather technical sutta but wanting to have a broader conversation about personal practice and comparative religion, but whatever, I wanted to find the actually expanded version of

“So you should truly see …
“Tasmātiha …pe…
Seeing this …
evaṁ passaṁ …pe…
They understand: ‘… there is no return to any state of existence.’
nāparaṁ itthattāyāti pajānāti.

SN22.85

and so I pasted nāparaṃ itthattāyāti pajānātīti into Digital Pāli Reader and got:

DN: 0
MN: 0
SN: 68
AN: 0

So again, my pali is non existent and I am sure there is the phrase “no more coming into any state of being” in the other nikayas, so after scratching my head quite a bit I finally figured out there’s a “double quote” (I don’t know the technical term) of titi at the end of the string, I had copied it from Sn22.82 by mistake, but still, this particular double quote occurs exclusively in SN!

This happens to me a LOT when I use Digital Pāli Reader and now also https://digitalpalidictionary.github.io/ (and as a side note the striking relationship between SN and the Vibangha is also very evident in DPD when looking at word frequencies, as is the similarity with what the DPD calls Khuddaka Nikāya 3 consisting of Mahāniddesapāḷi, Cūḷaniddesapāḷi, Paṭisambhidāmaggapāḷi, Nettippakaraṇapāḷi, Milindapañhapāḷi, Peṭakopadesapāḷi.)

Anyway, returning to “there is no return” if we search nāparaṃ itthattāyāti pajānā

we end up with results for

nāparaṃ itthattāyāti pajānāti 13 times, 8 times in DN, 1 time in MN, 3 times in SN, 1 time in AN
nāparaṃ itthattāyāti pajānātīti 67 times ALL in SN
nāparaṃ itthattāyāti pajānātīti.pañcamaṃ 1 time (in SN)
nāparaṃ itthattāyāti pajānāmāti 1 time in SN and
nāparaṃ itthattāyāti pajānāmīti 19 times, 1 time in MN, 5 times in SN, 13 times in AN (all in AN9 and AN10)

So it LOOKS like the original phrase is in DN, and is quoted (hence the titi) in SN 68 times. (plus a variant in AN9 and 10)

this seems like another little bit of evidence that DN precedes SN in this case.

Anyone who has better knowledge of the pali may have a much simpler explanation than I have, and I would welcome it while I wait for my online pali class to begin :slight_smile:

Metta.

well, might as well add a few more bits and pieces here;

in the DN context we have this “no more return” occuring in the context of 4 jhanas (no immaterial attainments) and projecting the mind towards knowledge and vision, thus;

When their mind has become immersed in samādhi like this—purified, bright, flawless, rid of corruptions, pliable, workable, steady, and imperturbable—they extend it and project it toward knowledge and vision.
So evaṁ samāhite citte parisuddhe pariyodāte anaṅgaṇe vigatūpakkilese mudubhūte kammaniye ṭhite āneñjappatte ñāṇadassanāya cittaṁ abhinīharati abhininnāmeti …pe…
This pertains to their knowledge. …
idampissa hoti vijjāya …pe…
They understand: ‘There is no return to any state of existence.’
nāparaṁ itthattāyāti pajānāti,
This pertains to their knowledge.
idampissa hoti vijjāya.
This is that knowledge.
Ayaṁ kho sā, ambaṭṭha, vijjā.

DN3

and

“It’s when a Realized One arises in the world, perfected, a fully awakened Buddha …
“idha, brāhmaṇa, tathāgato loke uppajjati arahaṁ sammāsambuddho …pe…
That’s how a mendicant is accomplished in ethics.
Evaṁ kho, brāhmaṇa, bhikkhu sīlasampanno hoti.
This, brahmin, is that ethical conduct. …
Idaṁ kho taṁ, brāhmaṇa, sīlaṁ …pe…
They enter and remain in the first absorption …
paṭhamaṁ jhānaṁ upasampajja viharati …
second absorption …
dutiyaṁ jhānaṁ …
third absorption …
tatiyaṁ jhānaṁ …
fourth absorption …
catutthaṁ jhānaṁ upasampajja viharati …pe…
They extend and project the mind toward knowledge and vision …
ñāṇadassanāya cittaṁ abhinīharati, abhininnāmeti …pe…
This pertains to their wisdom. …
Idampissa hoti paññāya …pe…
They understand: ‘… there is no return to any state of existence.’
nāparaṁ itthattāyāti pajānāti.
This pertains to their wisdom.
Idampissa hoti paññāya
This, brahmin, is that wisdom.”
ayaṁ kho sā, brāhmaṇa, paññā”ti.

DN4

It’s when a Realized One arises in the world, perfected, a fully awakened Buddha …
“Idha, brāhmaṇa, tathāgato loke uppajjati arahaṁ sammāsambuddho …pe…
That’s how a mendicant is accomplished in ethics. …
Evaṁ kho, brāhmaṇa, bhikkhu sīlasampanno hoti …pe…
They enter and remain in the first absorption …
paṭhamaṁ jhānaṁ upasampajja viharati.
This sacrifice has fewer requirements and undertakings than the former, yet is more fruitful and beneficial. …
Ayaṁ kho, brāhmaṇa, yañño purimehi yaññehi appaṭṭhataro ca appasamārambhataro ca mahapphalataro ca mahānisaṁsataro ca …pe…

They enter and remain in the second absorption …
Dutiyaṁ jhānaṁ …
third absorption …
tatiyaṁ jhānaṁ …
fourth absorption.
catutthaṁ jhānaṁ upasampajja viharati.
This sacrifice has fewer requirements and undertakings than the former, yet is more fruitful and beneficial. …
Ayampi kho, brāhmaṇa, yañño purimehi yaññehi appaṭṭhataro ca appasamārambhataro ca mahapphalataro ca mahānisaṁsataro cāti. …pe…

They extend and project the mind toward knowledge and vision …
Ñāṇadassanāya cittaṁ abhinīharati abhininnāmeti …
This sacrifice has fewer requirements and undertakings than the former, yet is more fruitful and beneficial.
ayampi kho, brāhmaṇa, yañño purimehi yaññehi appaṭṭhataro ca appasamārambhataro ca mahapphalataro ca mahānisaṁsataro ca …pe…

They understand: ‘… there is no return to any state of existence.’
nāparaṁ itthattāyāti pajānāti.
This sacrifice has fewer requirements and undertakings than the former, yet is more fruitful and beneficial.
Ayampi kho, brāhmaṇa, yañño purimehi yaññehi appaṭṭhataro ca appasamārambhataro ca mahapphalataro ca mahānisaṁsataro ca.
And, brahmin, there is no other accomplishment of sacrifice which is better and finer than this.”
Imāya ca, brāhmaṇa, yaññasampadāya aññā yaññasampadā uttaritarā vā paṇītatarā vā natthī”ti.

DN5

etc,

whereas, continuing my theme of kamma/jhana vs aggregates/not-self in DN vs SN, in SN by far the bulk of “there is no return” is places at the end of an enumeration of the aggregates formula SN22 giving 31 of the 77 occurrences in that Nikaya, but even outside of SN22 we have;

At Sāvatthī.
Sāvatthinidānaṁ.

Seated to one side, Venerable Rādha said to the Buddha:
Ekamantaṁ nisinno kho āyasmā rādho bhagavantaṁ etadavoca:

“Sir, they speak of this thing called ‘Māra-like nature’.
“‘māradhammo, māradhammo’ti, bhante, vuccati.
What is a Māra-like nature?”
Katamo nu kho, bhante, māradhammo”ti?

“Rādha, form has a Māra-like nature. Feeling, perception, choices, and consciousness have a Māra-like nature.
“Rūpaṁ kho, rādha, māradhammo, vedanā māradhammo, saññā māradhammo, saṅkhārā māradhammo, viññāṇaṁ māradhammo.

Seeing this …
Evaṁ passaṁ …pe…
They understand: ‘… there is no return to any state of existence.’”
nāparaṁ itthattāyāti pajānātī”ti.

SN23.12

At Sāvatthī.
Sāvatthinidānaṁ.

Seated to one side, Venerable Rādha said to the Buddha:
Ekamantaṁ nisinno kho āyasmā rādho bhagavantaṁ etadavoca:

“Sir, they speak of this thing called ‘impermanence’.
“‘aniccaṁ, aniccan’ti, bhante, vuccati.
What is impermanence?”
Katamaṁ nu kho, bhante, aniccan”ti?

“Rādha, form, feeling, perception, choices, and consciousness are impermanent.
“Rūpaṁ kho, rādha, aniccaṁ, vedanā aniccā, saññā aniccā, saṅkhārā aniccā, viññāṇaṁ aniccaṁ.

Seeing this …
Evaṁ passaṁ …pe…
They understand: ‘… there is no return to any state of existence.’”
nāparaṁ itthattāyāti pajānātī”ti.

SN23.13

With all of SN23 being repetitions like the above.

SN24 is the same with just one sutta given and the rest to be done “like in the last chapter”

SN35 switches it up and uses the 6 elements formulae instead of the 5 aggregates, again simply appending the “there is no return” quotation within a quotation at the end.